Did Hospice rush your loved ones death?

Windytown, thanks for clearing this up for me. It is very raw and perhaps I am being over sensitive. I just miss my mom a lot 😟

DarLove, My comment that this is not for sissies was not directed at people who don't like hospice. If you read it again, perhaps you'll get my gist that this dying business all the way around is not for sissies. It's hard for everyone. It certainly wasn't meant personally. I understand your feelings are really raw right now, so I understand. I was a living raw nerve right after my dad died. A sappy song in the grocery store had me reduced to a puddle of tears.

I'm sorry my comment made you feel bad. It certainly wasn't intended that way. I don't want to hurt anyone.

I chose pallative care over hospoce care for my mother with a chronic condition. She was medicated with morphine for comfort. Her death was not medicine induced, but by natural cause with her dignity intact and never a loss of quality of life.

Twinflower1 You know what is really sad if they are very sensitive to it not just from being elderly but with a sensitivity they can really develop a lot of complications from it and end up in the hospital where they are drugged into a coma again. It is so viscous. If they are in the hospital then they are costing too much and need to be put in hospice.It does not seem elders are allowed to be treated in the hospital even if they were sick from something the hospital did to them.They would rather have them in hospice to kill them if they cant kill them in the hospital. That is why laws have to changed cause this should not be acceptable.

I know cancer is extremely difficult to deal with. if hospice is helpful and caring and willing to not hurt the patient with deadly drugs or any other ways then that would be a good experience. The hospice that took care of my dad in our home was good. My mom was put in hospice strictly because of her age. They did not want to be bothered to finish treating her hospital fungal skin infection that had become bad because of no treatment.The treatment was started in another hospital but not continued,not only not continued but deadly treatment was used instead of what she needed.It was not just hospice but the hospital participated in the crime also.They all knew better when they treated her with a deadly treatment. She was already comatose from the last drugging, so they decided to take her life instead of simply treating her for a non terminal infection. I found out the way she got into hospice was by them lying about her having all kinds of end stages of many terminal illnesses that she never even had.It was absolutely shocking how cruel they were.

Do, not go, sorry

Darlove was it a not for profit hospice or not? And go people think this makes s difference?

Windytown, I don't think you have to be labeled a sissy if a person feels that Hospice was not right for them. I am thrilled that Hospice was able to help many others but in my case they really did over-medicate my mother. Just because someone may have had a bad experience with Hospice for their loved one, does not mean that we were not tough enough to withstand what was happening to our loved ones. Not trying to start a debate, just giving my honest opinion. I am having a tough time dealing with my mom's death & it hurts even more when someone tries to minimize the reasons for my pain however intentionally or otherwise. Please try to be more considerate for the people who had a bad experience with Hospice. We are truly not making up what transpired through our painful journey in dealing with watching our loved ones deteriorate in front of our eyes 😂

Marialake, Awwww, Your Bill is smiling down from Heaven. You did good girl, and took care of him as the best you could. This stuff is not for sissies!

My dear dad has been gone almost five years. He died in a hospice house and I would'nt change anything. They taught me how to moisten his lips with a q-tip when he couldn't take liquids any more. Hospice does more good than harm.

Marialake My dad also was the best man and family man ever. He also passed from cancer and was also in a whole lot of pain. hospice came to our house and helped him and my mom. It was a long time ago. The cancer took him not the hospice. He still wanted to live life watch us get our first job see his grandchildren etc etc It was so difficult when his life was cut so short.That disease took him, not evil medical staff like the way my mom was taken from us. My dad got to die and actually without any help from hospice. That is not real common though.From the comments just on here hospice has pushed people in to death. I have talked to people and read many comment on the web about hospice rushing people to their deaths.That is so wrong cause people deserve to die when they are ready not because they are pushed into it. Now they are doing horrible things and taking perfectly fine elders and putting them in hospice to kill them like they did with my mom. They started killing her in the hospital first. She was also the best mom and wife and grandma and aunt etc etc like my dad. I still cant even believe that I have to talk about her in the past this long after they took her life.. It was so difficult when my dad and grandma and other loved ones pass but my mom was the hardest cause her life was taken just because she was an elder. She should still be here today if it weren't for medical staff stealing her away from us.

I must add that my sweet husband also received hospice care. He had a vicious experience with cancer. His pain was relentless and nothing helped - it was traumatic for him and I - and our kids. Our oncologist told us to get hospice - there was nothing more he could do and Bill's pain was awful. Hospice was unable to stop that "freight train pain" but they sure helped me and the kids. I adored my husband and would do anything for him. But the cancer was torturing him mercilessly. A great, wonderful, kind, awesome man. I would not force him to endure more. Hospice treated his pain as best they could and he still lingered for another long and painful 7 weeks. God bless him. His final days were spent at the in-house hospice. I lived there with him. Slept in his bed with him. Hospice people catered to him and to me too. I was a mess and they embraced me. I adored Bill and still do. I still feel married - he didn't divorce me, he died!! Now it is time to care for his mother............arrgh. She's totally not like him. But hospice is helping me. My kids help - but my goodness, they have babies to take care of and jobs to do. Hospice helps me and takes the pressure of my kids. They've had enough heartbreak - sure don't want to see their mom crash and burn. lol Most days, I ask the Good Lord, "why is it that instead of wonderful Bill.............I have his vindictive mother in my living room???" Well, because that's the story that God wants me to live for now. Was Bill worth it? A million times worth it. The best guy ever. Ever.
Thanks for listening all. He's been dead for 5 years and I still miss him in every single corner of my life.

Marialake, Thank you for sharing your experience. Count me among the grateful ones and God bless you and MIL on your journey. 20 months is a long time.

It's good to hear some real life stories that are different from the OP. Everyone's stories are not the same just as everyone's death experience of their loved one is not the same. I'd never discourage someone from at least checking out their local hospice. They were a godsend to my family as well.

My MIL has been on hospice for 20 months. No one is trying to kill her. She quit walking and getting out of bed. Put up a huge fuss no matter what I did. Hospice came in and help me to bathe this huge woman. They provide diapers etc. I've never been forced to medicate her - ever. But when she gets wild and crazy (hitting, biting) I will give her meds to calm her down. She still eats and drinks and swears a lot. If hospice was trying to kill her.................it's been 20 months.................... They have really helped me and I'm grateful for their assistance.

dogabone you are cruel to talk the way you did to someone in such pain. you are an unfeeling person and know it all . hospice can be terrible. it depends who you get. they over medicate all the time. my husband is dying of cancer. and when they wanted to give him a blood transfusion and kidney cath I said no and took him home. he has almost died twice with to many meds. and the wrong ones together, sometimes it is more beneficial if they die. they make quite a bit running around setting up funeral arrangements and always tell you be sure to call us first if he dies., its always call us first. they worry to much about there money. when they spend 15 minutes taking temp, and blood pressure and get a whopping amount of money for each visit dont kid your self. so it all depends on who you get, they will also take control of your house and dont even ask to use your bathrooms or kitchen. I have a good hospice person now. but watch my hubby close on what they give him

My Aunt's doctor put her on hospice. She was not terminal, just elderly. I fired them after a day. My Aunt was having a delirium due to overmedication and she came right out of it after the meds were stopped. I did a little investigating.
Medicare pays hospice 100% of costs of care. HMOs save a lot of money not treating elderly in the emergency room or the hospital because they don't have to accept Medicare payments which are far below private pay. From their perspective It pays to put elders on hospice. Most HMOs have an in-house hospice. In the assisted living facility where my Aunt lived, I was asked every so often to place her on hospice. I don't know what their motivation was, but my Aunt was having a choking episode, turning blue and the facility nurse called me and asked me what I wanted to do. I said take her to the hospital, but that didn't happen until I had the doctor give the order.(she coughed up a wad of phlegm and was fine). At the hospital, I was told by the RN that the EMTs had told him the facility was trying to force hospice for my Aunt, by not calling for help. This was outrageous.
I moved my Aunt, and the new facility only calls hospice when the patient is in a serious decline, has stopped eating and is withdrawing from the world. In other words, days from death. My Aunt is in good health, still eats heartily, loves to do things and is happy to enjoy her time with family and friends. I will protect her life until she is ready to go and that is not having a problem with making peace. It's respecting her life until it's over.
I have heard many times that even if patients are coherent, eating and enjoying life, they are drugged and given meds to "ease their breathing". No, to depress their breathing until they die. . It sounds so harsh, but I've heard these stories from friends who have lost parents for years. If you haven't been through it before, you trust medical professionals, and you don't realize what is happening until it dawns on you how awful it is. Caregivers suffer horribly when this happens to a loved one. We arent' given enough information about what is really going on. We all want a peaceful death for our family, even if it's rare.
We need to know more about what we can demand ethically from our medical providers. I sure want to know where the lines are. When my doctor gave the order to move my Aunt to memory care, he gave them a list of all the orders she would need as a dying person. He told me to stop all medical care. I didn't. She will be monitored and cared for and kept comfy until she's ready to go. Just not with that doctor.

Veronica91 My mom had a skin fungal infection that she got from hospital when she came in for the elective procedure originally. Before that she had not been to the hospital but a few times like when she had her tonsils out as a child. I had talked to the doctor that had told me that he diagnosed the hospital skin hospital infection when she first got it. It was never treated not even with fungal cream, nothing.Some doctor gave her prednisone which does not help a fungal infection. It just made it worse. She was just very neglected even by her own doctor. Her own family doctor even said she did not know what the infection was on her skin and also neglected it like it was nothing.She suddenly told me that my mom had a disease that ended up on the death certificate. It was so very strange why she would have purposelessly mis diagnosed my mom. I was absolutely just flabbergasted. This was her doctor that she and I trusted. I told the doctor that had done the procedure about my mom's doctor suddenly diagnosing her with this disease. He said she did not have that disease but at the end he put it on her death certificate. That disease and the others that they said she had were all on the original death certificate.The real reason of death was put on after the investigation. All those diseases listed made it look like she was at the end of her rope,especially when they said end stages. Why and how could they get away with such manipulation. It was horrible.She had to come back to the hospital because of complications of all the overdoses.
The infection finally got so bad from never being treated. She was saved by a good doctor though. She was still unconscious from the original drug overdose, but her skin healed up for the first time after just two days of treatment. She had actually been sent to icu because of the overdose when the infection got bad. She was getting as much adivan cocktails as the staff wanted to give her while she was unconscious from the original overdosing. Then they were saying she was having stroke like symptoms, seriously, what do they expect. All the nurses had to do was call out dnr and adivan and they would rush it over to her. When I saw that I was shocked. The nurse was a little frazzled and surprised to see me so soon. She did not expect me to come in at that time. I was supposed to have still been waiting for them to set her up in the icu. She told me with a little nervous voice and acted somewhat ashamed, that I could say no to the advain. I told her will yeah she is unconscious and she is in here for an overdose. She just gave me an uncomfortable smile and that was that. This was not the first hospital that this happened in. The exact thing happened for the exact reason at the original hospital. It was on her chart that she could not have the sedatives and I explained it the staff and mom said no too, but I walked out for a second to run to the pharmacy and when I came back she was drugged into a coma. I also looked at them in shock and they also told me in the same way that the other nurse told me that I could say no to the drugs. This was also while she was recovering from a previous drug overdose. My mom never had time to recover before she would be overdosed again.She could not tolerate it but then again who could tolerate that much deadly drugs. It almost killed her on other occasions. She must have been so weakened from the overdoses over and over again. Even though she was unconscious she was getting much better after the infection got so bad.Her skin had cleared for the first time during this proper treatment that she got for 2 days in the hospital. Her vitals came back to normal but she still needed to be treated.
She was then transferred back to the hospital that did her procedure. This happened to be the same hospital that would not treat her for this infection when it was still a skin infection, even though it had been diagnosed. Some how we thought that they would treat it. All records had been transferred over to this hospital explaining the treatment and what she was diagnosed with etc all the details and the nurse had also been told what my mom had. The nurse knew of the treatment and knew that it had to be continued at least for two weeks to a year. I explained it to her but she knew already she had some knowledge about this. They instead treated it with antibiotics which will only make the infection worse. As soon as this hospital took over with the antibiotics the infection on the skin came back and she started going down hill. In the charts it said that there was a meeting of doctors who decided because of her age she did not deserve the treatment maybe not in those words but if you read between the lines you would see. They also made up that she was terminal and only had less than six months to live.Since she was elder and unconscious they were able to say that one of the things she was dying from was end stages of alzheimer's and many other things that elders can get. all of them the investigators found out to be wrong. It is amazing how well the medical staff was able to manipulate everything to get what they wanted. At the very end she swelled up cause she was dying like at the other hospital before she was treated. When that happened hospice took her off of piccline food and gave her as much insulin as they wanted to. The other hospital was always carefully monitoring her insulin level.The good staff at the other hospital said that even though she was on the picc line that she still never needed any insulin. So she was not given any. They did right by her.When she was bloating up and her body was shutting down they not only kept the antibiotics going and still would not give her the anti fungal meds they actually put the needle in her neck to make sure she would get enough antibiotics as if she was not getting enough to kill her. The nurses knew her history from the other hospital and I had also explained it and they knew of the proper treatment. If I was in that position I would definitely not use that antibotic on someone with that serious of a fungal infection. They even knew better. Since they knew better I thought they would do right by her but I was so wrong and really I should have called 911 at the beginning. I did not protect her enough. I dont know if I could have done anything to get them to listen cause they always did as they wanted to no matter how much I protested and I was afraid that they would just call security on me if I complained too much. It was all so unbelievable. I felt like I had no other choice but to trust them and that was very wrong. There just has to be laws in place and reinforced. Euthanasia of any form is not allowed in this state but they are getting away with it cause no one wants to deal with it.It is just easier to sweep it under the carpet. When my lawyer( who was also a medical doctor) went over the medical records he also did not want to deal with euthanasia especially with an elder. He knew it was done but he did not believe in it himself. He worked in one of the hospitals that she was in. I just don't know how anyone can just euthanize a real human being like they are a dog and then to top it all off a healthy human being. WTH are sickos like this working in the medical field. I am usually a pushover when it comes to punishment, but in this situation these monsters deserve punishment like prison time. An example needs to be set so monsters can not get away with these kinds of things. I have not even spoke of all the abuse that took place by medical staff this is just some of it.It is just does not feel real how this can happen with ones that you are supposed to be able to trust. I wonder how many times this happens where the family is unaware what happened. I knew because she was healthy and I knew my mom well.

My deep condolences to you flowgo. We believe that my mother was drugged to death also with the combo of Oxycodone & Ativan. Although it may have helped to ease the pain, we believe that she was prescribed too much for her little body to handle as well as her not having enough nutrients in her body due to her not being able to eat. If you're not eating the drugs are going to take an even deeper effect & will shut down your respiratory system quickly. We believe there had to be a better way to treat the sick & elderly as opposed to plying them with hard core drugs & rushing their death. I bear the guilt of not recognizing what was happening due to being overwhelmed by my mother's sudden decline. I will carry this guilt with me always. 😞

That is why I am so upset at the medical staff. There was no reason for what they did. They knew better it was never a mistake contrary to what I want to believe. What they did took her life.

We did find out what she died from.

My dad was on hospice for last stages of cancer which is very difficult. He was in pain, but he was completely in control of his pain and his life. He decided when he wanted to go. No decisions were made for him especially when he was to die. He always remained conscious. He was young and did not want to die, he wanted to be able to spend quality time with his family at the end of his life. He was at least in control of his last days and was not pushed into death like hospice usually does now. He died naturally when his body gave out on him, not when their was enough drugs in him to force him to die.
My mom was already being pushed into dying by drug overdoses in the hospital and hospice just finished her off. She was already being killed by the hospital for no reason at all. An owner of a dog would usually not want to put a dog down just because it was old. So how could someone in their right mind do that to a human being. If anyone insisted I kill someone I would quit that job.There is no reason to force someone to die. It is up to the person to decide when they want to go and they have the right to do what they want when it comes to their life.

Many people spend the last few days of their lives sleeping or actually unconscious with or without drugs. Exhausted you describe your father as strangling and suffering. hospice used the combination of morphine and ativan to ease his pain and anxiety. You describe him as being out of it which may well have been due to the medications but not giving them would have been a terrible way to die so you are blessed to have made the decision to allow hospice to keep him comfortable. Blessings

I wondered that about Hospice, too. My dad was failing, age 91 and had a mesothelioma-like condition. He was alive and lucid one day, fell, and was gone 6 days later. After his fall, we got Hospice to come in. They gave him the morphine/Ativan combo and he went "out of it". I felt he had only a few weeks of breathing left before the fall...he was strangling and suffering, although mentally lucid. This just made his last week less painful. The other benefit to Hospice is for the family! They were wonderful to us and ever so helpful! Even though I still wonder about that drug combo and Hospice, I am grateful he didn't suffer more. We should all be blessed with just going to sleep and then the heart stopping.

The Liverpool Care Pathway, to give it its full title. It got a bad name and they're calling it a number of other things now. Like any other prescriptive process, it is (or was) a tool that could be used well, by thinking and skilled care teams, or badly, by overstretched staff in too much of a bloody hurry.

It was never designed to be a resource-saving policy aimed at rubbing out old people before they cost the NHS too much time or money. Unfortunately this perception became the one that prevailed, and hence the LCP was discarded for largely political reasons; so that the doctors and nurses who do the work of guiding terminally ill, frail, elderly people to a dignified and peaceful end will now once again have to work out their own route there from scratch. Let's hope they will always have the skill and the time to do it well enough to compensate for the loss of many decades' combined experience of caring for the dying.

What you are speaking of is called "The Liverpool Pathway" in the UK and is to my knowledge no longer used. Maybe CM or Jude know more about it.
Flogo did you request an autopsy to determine what you believe was the cause of her death?

Camellia, Thank you, During all of my research, I have read a lot about something called death pathway in UK for the terminally sick and the elderly. I have read that some elders have been put on it even though they were not terminal or even sick just elder. I have also read that people and the general public are speaking out about it and are not tolerating it. It does seem like many people in the UK are more aware of it and trying to stop it from happening.There are many people over hear that just want to sweep it under the carpet like the medical staff who believe in it.There are others who will just look away unless it happened to them.We may not have the exact death pathway that you have but something eerily similar.I like the fact that so many people in the UK are trying to make a difference and seem to be very involved in trying to stop the terrible medical abuse(haldol adivan etc sedatives) and other abuse, neglect and murder of elders. So maybe things are improving over there hopefully, although I would always keep my guard up anyway. Hopefully it will happen here also.

First thing is people have to become aware of it, Then when people actually seeing what is happening start seeing what is happening and really going on maybe then we can do something about it.The more it is talked about the more people will come out and tell their experiences. Hopefully we can ban together and the fight the fight and stop these kind of atrocities from being acceptable cause how can such horrible abuse, neglect and murder be acceptable in this day and age but it still is.

It was not only hospice, it was the hospitals and recovery facility that she stayed at that did most of the killing hospice just finished her off.My dad was in hospice back in the day the hospice he was in did not kill him even when he was dying, they still did not kill him. The staff does not get in trouble cause how can they when it is an elder in the hospital. That is enough to keep them out of trouble even if she is in very good health. It is still an elder in the hospital they can say anything. At least I proved that she was not terminal with the death certificate but nothing matters they can euthanize people like dogs and it is ok even if it is obvious I'm just not sure how they are allowed to get away with it. People have got away with other murders before look at our history. It used to be legal to murder and abuse many groups of different people if we look back on our history. It still continues. This has got to stop.

Flowgo words cannot express my sympathy for you with what you must have been through. It must continue to be a living nightmare for you and I wish you peace.

However on the subject of DNR's. My poor mum was diagnosed with terminal pancreatic cancer, we thought on the DNR issue for a few days as it is a massive thing to have to consider esp when you are still reeling from a terminal diagnosis and the decline has really kicked in, which it had for my mum (diagnosis to death in 6 weeks). But if the situation had arisen that my mum had, say, a heart attack and had stopped breathing , would it have been right to go all out to get her heart started again only to suffer massive pain etc and die of this painful cancer? I Imagine each case is very individual but I do think DNR's have their place.

Then again I am in the UK so I do t know if our regulations are slightly different.

Bry1969 The police will tell you to go to the medical board who is there to protect the doctors.The system is designed to protect medical workers. Where is the patient protection. Actually no where in site. As I said in another post, I researched why doctors and staff would kill patients and read about doctors and staff who were serial killers in the news. It often took years for them to be caught.They will only get caught if they continue the killing spree and never let up, only then would it make it easier to catch them. So if it is that hard to catch medical serial killers. It will be really hard to catch a killer who is not a serial killer. If there is any suspicion that a medical staff is murdering patients the hospital will just let them go, lay them off or the evil doctor nurse will decide to move on. I found out when a complaint is made with dept of health they will talk to one or two people who work there only one time and not continue to keep an eye on them anymore then that one time check. As soon as they are done talking to a person or two at the hospital then the medical staff are free to do as the please again. If evil medical staff are concerned that somehow they may be caught then they can move to another hospital or nursing home.There are doctors and medical staff who kill and never get caught cause the investigators etc don't want to bother with it since it could have been a mercy killing or euthanasia which is considered murder but somehow it seems to be swept under the table as long as it does not happen to much. That is why serial killers move on to prevent getting caught. Most medical facilities do not do much of a background check especially nursing homes. It is about time we get some kind of patient protection, but I am not sure how this can be done. Something needs to be done. I'm sure that the killing of my mom was suspected as a mercy killing euthanasia, so then why bother. My mom was not even terminal and in good health.So really I don't even see how it could have been called a mercy killing.It seems as long as it is even suspected that it was a mercy killing euthanasia, then the investigation is over.The staff can say that we did everything we could and the rest is swept under the table.The best investigation was when they proved that my mom did not die of all the terminal diseases that the staff said she had died from. So they proved she was not terminal. I had a lawyer who was a medical doctor also, he was working with me until he found out she was euthanized which is the same thing as murdered.There was not even a reason to put her down, even if she was a dog. He said he would never do that but he does know of other doctors who do. He had to drop the case after that and my year was up for supposedly wrongful death to find another lawyer. It was more than a wrongful death it was murder.Police can not help with this. This is another good reason for not making any kind of euthanasia legal. and dnrs should be banned. Thank you anyway for your concern.

Hospice for my mother who passed 2 weeks ago today was so very wonderful kind and loving towards my mother and I. Everything imaginable to keep mom comfortable was supplied to us. Not only the meds, but a hospital bed, depends, gloves, lotions, dressing for the pressure sore she developed, special wound care nurse, her own nurse 3 times a week, baths 2 x's a week, massages and musical therapy.... If we needed we got it. Plus, her wonderful nurse was by our side while mom passes.

Yes, I had a fridge full of drugs but she didn't have to take the unless I felt she needed comfort meds, which I hardly felt... the last week I really started giving her a little.... no, Hospice was a Godsend to both of us. Maybe having Hospice at home with your loved one is easier since you get to monitor/give the meds yourself?

Sorry how it turned out for you :(