I waver between believing desperately in a force for Good and Kindness and Parity in this world and total Atheism.
Those who are "legitimately/ specifically" religious DO NOT READ FURTHER!
GOD is NOT easing my burdens, making a place for me at "HIS TABLE" I have no use for be-jeweled crowns, or arranged seating charts by burdens and goodness.
No GOD is taking my part or my place, Jesus is not cleaning grandpas urinals, or wiping feces off the walls. Mohamed is not standing between me and grandpas disgusting leering glances. Buddha is no where when I twitch,stressed out trying to sleep. Yahweh, Jehovah, RA, Zeus and the Prophet Moroni are NOT walking my steps with me and doing the work or soothing the aches of mind and body. I have prayed, begged, hoped, wished, VISUALIZED, pay'd it forward, meditated on it, slept on it and yearned for years of nothing but the same BS. IF I believed in a GOD of endless, repetitious misery, I would be an enigma in that I would have actual proof "of".
I did not intend my response to be "religious BS" "jargon" or in any way judgemental or harassing. I thought I had heard your cry, understood your anger and resentment, and taken the philosophical argument to its logical conclusion. I'm not condemning your thoughts, just exploring them ... where do they lead? Is it where you wanted to go?
Also, I did not reject or denegrate your opinion of many religious people. I've seen the same attitudes and can clearly see and hear why you feel that way. I'm not harranging you, castigating you, or trying to hurt you, I know you are dealing with a very difficult situation, and sometimes the only vent available is to blame others - but I didn't do those things you've laid at my feet, and neither did God. Should people judge who you are by looking at how your grandfather treats you? People let you down - they always will. People aren't perfect.
You asked me specifically if "my God" would be responsible for your life if you believed in Him. That's a funny question. You see, I believe "my God" is sovereign. I believe He is in control, even when it hurts, even when I can't see Him, even when a baby dies. I believe "my God" allows me the freedom of free-will. Lots of times I don't understand it, and the pain is hard to bear, and man oh man ... do I hear you! I want to beg and plead and cry out, "WHERE ARE YOU?" But I've explored the depths ... and I KNOW "my God" is Just. I'm not preaching to you, or trying to make you believe in "my God" ... just answering your question as best as I can.
Be easy - lets drop the stereotyped "religious bigot" speech, and try to really see who we both are. I think I see you, and I recognize the hurt and anger. I'm not trying to rain on your pity party, just humming a little counterpoint to spice it up. ;>
"It's all fun and games until someone gets hurt!"
I am bigoted against religion because I think it makes people not think for them selves, like there is any thing wrong with that.
I am sorry if I hurt you but I meant to, see, bitter mean nasty. I have been angry and snappish for along time. I don't want to be I don't know. I can't see myself as a accepting happy loving person, I care but i keep my distance. People have been very unkind to me in my life, the ones who were not stand out it profound relief, now I bring it on myself most of the time.
I am angry and resentful that some people seem to have good lives, came from loving families where they were cared for and respected not abused and humiliated.
I do understand your idea that not so much that is is all good but that it is "OK" so to speak, That all things in life can I don't know that death isn't terrible and that there will be peace and understanding.
But like the Jewish people after the holocaust I can put God on trial and find a great deal to be resentful for.
I do not find it easy to come to terms with "loving god" and so much cruelty and suffering in the world. and I do not do devils. It would be easier to think there is no god and it is all biology and society and selfish hateful men but I need to believe there is god somewhere and that there will be justice and peace at the end. What an awful feeling that there is nothing and it is all just here and then just dead, dirt, no soul going on..
There are people who have had worse than me and are better people than me. I don't want to be a bad person but I think I just am.
I agree with you about that "awful feeling" ... it's a lot to take in, and not for the faint-hearted. Just let me say (without putting any religious spin on it) ... don't give up yet. I think you are conscious, aware, and realistic, but have a hard time removing yourself and your thoughts from the years of anger, resentment, and disgust you've felt at being stuck where you are.
Change happens one step at a time ... and even you have to take that first step, then the next ... and now I can hear the lyrics of the Eagles (The Wall) blazing through my head. Sez it better than I ever could ...
"I'm woving in a fanasy, I can't believe the things I see. The path that I have chosen now has led me to a WALL. It rises now before me, the dark and silent barrier between, ALL I am, and all that I would ever want to BE ... it's just a travesty ..."
Forgive me if my choice in music dates me - I live in such lyrics :) Music is my escape hatch.
i think I missed whole developmental stages..does it show? Still I am not stupid enough to think I am not responsible. It has been my life since I was 18. I am not responsible for my parents choices, their happiness or unhappiness, but it is my fault if I make the same bad choices. Least with out children I won't make the next generation o f miserable sots in this world...
Why IS life so hard and complicated? Why can't some things just be easy?
I will probably re-open some of my old books.
But I insist that you have to find a meaning and peace in yourself. If any kind of religion can help you, well. If any kind of religion makes you feel worse, forget it. There are many many ways (meditation, breathing, yoga...) You have to find "yours"!
I know Buddha was the teacher not a "God Head". Though I still think it is tacky to rub his belly at Chinese restaurants..what a guarantee you wont get food poisoning?
I don't like to rub Buddha's belly, but i had a small collection of little Buddha statues and I liked them, because they laughed or smiled. They put me in a good mood.
You will have friends to help you too, when the time comes.
If you need it so much that no matter what someone else says or doesn't agree with one about you still tell your self "Ah but they are wrong, unhappy and do not know what I KNOW..etc." Well I imagine that is human and self buttressing and inevitable. But be prepared to be disagreed with, no matter how much it bugs you, your “TRUTH” really isn’t. While I don't believe "Man created God" in that sense, I do believe man refined god to suit his own needs, GOD is almost always a "he" and white where "he" is wanted to be white and black where wanted black etc..."God the Father" sounds like ancestor worship to me. And the sexist, patriarchal position of most religions sounds far more like what men want and need to believe as being god, than god. Most imaginings of god paint a creature with profoundly man type and human man type needs and wishes, where women and dirty and evil and the tool of satan and men are the lords of ALL they see/own. It is too too obvious to me. Why would god need a penis any way I mean exactly? God the father eh? So where is the mother.? Ancient man womb envy and desire for social control looks like the back ground of most religions to me, not miracles, articles of faith or simple tales of a world long gone and how the people survived. Religion to me is social control and the creation of bias and hierarchies that men all around the world benefit from to this day and therefore perpetrate. I mean, would men support a religion that told them they were un-worthy and un-clean, non-entities here to do the bidding of others and to be regarded as less than human as right and fact and duh? If GOD created all life and woman creates life from her very body, why would GOD find this offensive? Unless this so envision “GOD” was a man who could not do that himself? Envied and feared the creative and mysterious power of women, these are people from some 2,000 years ago mind you, and so decided to try and trump her gifts and power and say the ultimate act of creation, all this…“Yeah a MAN did it, a really big one, in the sky, He looked just like me! Yeah and if you don’t do what I say, cause I am a man and we are men and you are not, well you are gonna go and burn and writhe in hell for all eternity…because “God Loves You“…Moronic. Obvious and Moronic. And I don’t need it thank you.
A "character" who exists from the time of Adam and Eve!
No pouncing allowed......!
Eh good days and bad. He goes when he goes, but I won't become a Christian when he is gone, that is not the way I feel I was a heretic before.
Thank you for your support though.
People believe what they want and need to, it helps them, it feeds their souls. I guess, I am a hypocrite I defend it and I think it is stupid, but so what. The religious people will consider me a lost, blasphemous soul and a test of their own faith, while I consider them childish, uneducated and wantonly stubborn in their views so every body wins.
One of the strongest motivating forces for any belief system, no not denial, is the feeling of being righteously despised, that is that one feels one is part of a picked on or badly treated minority. whether this is true in fact or not it is a group solidifying and identifying feelings, the "US" and "THEM" thing, works for any group. We are right they are wrong and if we are not careful they will destroy us all.
In history that does actually happen literally, hell it happens now in Africa, killing and raping and maiming of "THOSE NOT US" , modern day genocide. Granted, greed is always at the back of this no matter what scriptural excuse they offer...US and Mexican gangs, The Muslim groups who hate us only slightly more than they hate each other...
there has to be a "them" for there to be an "us". For some people you can't be and "us" without and oppositional "them".
I am damned, because I believe that a Governments Prime responsibility should be to it's people, ALL of them, not just the rich ones.Fine with me, I will take that on.
Why do these closed views so often go hand in hand...or foot in mouth, conservative ideology politically and organized religion? Control, greed, bigotry? I guess that is why Bullshit and smoke screens and mud slinging were created. Distraction from facts.
Granted, it is not as extreme for everyone, People just have different ideas about how they want things done. I feel personally, many religious conservatives truly take brother keeper to heart as well as the polls. They resent being told it is un-christian to judge and blame the poor for being so and then turn around and want the right to control others lives. They want no constraints on big business but wish to legislate every personal behavior imaginable. I get the feeling they view others rights, that offend them personally, as infringing on their freedoms. Literally. That you, "Whom I so despise, are allowed to do or say such and such is infringing on MY freedoms to consider you less than me and kept in your proper place."
I know there are intelligent, compassionate republicans who simply have fiscally conservative views, but why are there so many on the right, who find the exalting of disrespect as an acceptable code and a response somehow to difference they disapprove of and stupidity as a rallying point for the running of a nation? Of all the things to use as a standard...