I have something called MSA. I'll be dead in a couple of years, and I don't want to drag my wife down with me. After 20 years of marriage, she is doing all she can to keep me alive, but I think she's beginning to resent her situation and deserves a pleasant change.
I have working plans for a device that will end my life quickly and painlessly, inexpensively and pretty-much without a mess, but someone will still have to see my dead body in order to hide the device from a coroner who might declare my death as a suicide. I have a few life insurance policies that will be voided by suicide.
My wife isn't affectionate, anymore--I have to ask her for kisses now--and she is always angry (I mean, every waking hour). The most difficult aspect for me is realizing we have been intimate maybe three times in as many years. The few times expressed desire for her, she ridiculed me. I believe it's safe to say that our marriage is mostly loveless, now.
Should I ask her to hide the device so she can collect insurance?
Is this "wrong?"

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No. You cannot die now.

Maybe I will come back and talk to you, but right now with the limited knowledge I do have, it could be the depression talking.

What I want to avoid, James, is for you to start a discussion that would set up caregivers on this forum to weigh in on their opinions on whether or not a patient with your diagnosis should commit suicide. Essentially, using these sincere people to become your death panel to give permission for suicide or euthanasia. A topic sure to cause a heated discussion and division.

What we can do for you, is to help clear your thinking, find viable solutions to each problem.

You do not know how long you will live.
Suicide is not an option.

Excuse my tough love response, to a stranger yet. It is necessary in my opinion.
Helpful Answer (10)
shad250 Feb 2020
He is trying to give his wife "freedom "
Before I forget, please don't post your real name, if that is in fact what it is.   Anyone can access the forum and gain information that could be used for someone else's benefit.     I did a quick check and found information that I don't think you would want to be public knowledge, such as your home address.

Please either call the Aging Care admins ASAP at this number:   (239) 594-3222 or e-mail them at , at the bottom of the page, and ask them to delete all the personal information you provided.      Especially given your condition, you don't want to become a target for someone who decides you're vulnerable and wants to exploit it.

I had to look up MSA, as I suspected it was one of the muscular degenerative diseases.    From the NIH (  (no copyright limitation posted on the home page):

"progressive neurodegenerative disorder characterized by a combination of symptoms that affect both the autonomic nervous system (the part of the nervous system that controls involuntary action such as blood pressure or digestion) and movement. The symptoms reflect the progressive loss of function and death of different types of nerve cells in the brain and spinal cord."

James, I am sorry to learn of this diagnosis, but complement you on wanting to address it now in terms of your life as well as your wife's.   I think that's quite valiant and thoughtful of you to be concerned about her role in your care.

Send raises some good points, and I think she's right that posters are going to take sides, and I also think that you may become subject to religious lectures, or just plain lectures which don't address the situation but do focus on individual positions.

So I'll try to walk the middle line.    Have you or your wife had an opportunity to determine what options are available for short and long term care, including assistance through any of the organizations that address this condition?  I'm not familiar with the long term care benefits of public education, but wonder if there are any funds that could assist you?  Or any programs?

Have you contacted any of the organizations that address this condition, such as the ones listed on the NIH URL above?  Are they able to offer any insights, coping mechanisms, or assistance for retrofitting your home?

Some things to consider as well: downsizing to a home on one floor (if you don't already have that) or retrofitting your existing house to accommodate anticipated changes?   Perhaps if funding is available for modifications it will help you stay in your home for a longer time.

Are there any funds available for assistance when it becomes more necessary?   Any support groups, especially through hospitals?   Some have neurological specialties, so they might be more helpful.  

What I'm thinking is trying to find sources to support you both, now and in the future, to minimize the strain on both of you now as well as going forward, and as you both make future plans.    If some of the caregiving pressure is relieved, you may both feel better.  

BTW, are you a Veteran?

At some point your condition apparently will become more critical, and then you may have to make the assessment that you're considering now.   And, who knows?  Some medication may ease the challenges you're facing.

I don't mean to sound casual, or make light of your situation, certainly not.   I'm just trying to think of options to ease life for both of you now.  

I wish you peace as you contemplate your options.
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Yes, it is wrong. It is fraud. Fraud is a criminal offence.

I am extremely sorry to read about your situation.

Of course I don't know her or what she thinks about life, death, love, sickness, disability, marriage or anything else; but I doubt if a woman who has been married to you for twenty years and hasn't left in spite of the stress she must be under will consider losing you a pleasant change. Don't do this to her.

Tell her to get help. "She is angry every waking hour" probably means that she is:

burning out
and angry.

Aren't YOU angry? I'd be furious. What's happening to you is incredibly unfair.

Are you in touch with people who understand the disease and can counsel you and your wife?
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This post, to me, feels like a set up. The profile is set up as 'the wife' yet the post is written as 'the husband' who wants to end his life but allow 'his wife' to collect on his life insurance policies, which is fraud. The poster is asking US to help him/her defraud the insurance companies by advising if the suicide device should be hidden so the money can be collected!!! Plus, the profile is using a first name, last name AND city & state, so a paper trail is left behind to boot.

According to the profile, this couple lives in Texas. "Under state law in Texas, physician-assisted suicide or using medical intervention to bring death sooner than its natural occurrence is also unlawful."

I have no advice to offer about fraud. I will offer my best wishes to both of you moving forward, and hope that you will choose to make honest decisions that won't cause even more grief than you're already suffering.
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ExhaustedPiper Feb 2020
I agree.

"James" has given thought to the coroner finding his device during an investigation, and wanting to be stealth by asking if his wife should hide the device and collect insurance (fraud), but puts his intentions, real name and location on the internet.

That combined with the profile looking like the wife wrote it, who claims they are having money problems.

In my opinion, this is a troll or a set up.
I am so sorry you're experiencing this.  I can't imagine what it must be like for you and won't even try.  I will say that what you're contemplating is wrong.  It may bring an end to "your" suffering, but it will only add to your wife's.  Your wife's indifference and anger are the result of watching the man she loves slip away from her, doing the best she can to help you and make you comfortable, while all the time knowing she's losing you.  She has burnout.  Please consider this:  you CAN enter a nursing home and receive specialized care and she can get the rest she needs - she can visit you daily (or as often as possible).  This would be a win-win situation for both of you.  You will receive the specialized care you need and she will get the rest she needs and be better able to comfort and support you.  You obviously love your wife very much - and no doubt, she loves you as well.  Please reach out for help.  If nothing else, Hospice is a wonderful organization and they're only a phone call away.  They've cared for several people in my family and we found them to be skilled, compassionate professionals who walked with us through very difficult times.  No words can comfort you - but I want you to know that you are loved.  More than you know.
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I will never understand this. We put down cats and dogs by the vet and put to sleep in a humane way. But not people. People have to suffer.
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In my experience suicide is often one of the first things comes to mind when people are still processing a frightening diagnosis, I wonder if you have only recently received this devastating news? I urge you to not do anything rashly based on fear and incomplete information, take the time to calmly and rationally explore all your options.
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anonymous1009902 Feb 2020
Hi, cwillie. I was diagnosed with MSA on May 1st, 2016, and since then I've lost the abilities to stand un-aided, speak coherently or audibly, and I have to use a catheter to go to the bathroom at least 5 times per day. Also, I was recently diagnosed with mild dementia.
MSA is a frightening disease, and I don't think I fully understand my own mortality. After reading the replies to my post, I realized suicide. isn't a good idea.
I'm sorry you are facing this. I'm a bit confused because your profile page is written from your wife's perspective as the account holder, is there a reason for that James?
In order to access physician assisted death you would need to establish residency in one of the states where it is offered, is this something that would be possible for you?
Helpful Answer (4)

Point of information: As a 40 year insurance company manager who dealt with underwriting and contestable claims---
Life insurance policies have a "contestable" period, usually 2 years from the date the policy was put into force. After that, the policy pays, even in the event of a suicide or a pre-existing condition. Read the policy you have to learn about the provisions. If the death was caused by suspected foul play (a murder for instance,) the designated beneficiary may not be able to receive the proceeds if they were involved in the foul play. Life insurance is highly regulated by state insurance commissioners and provisions are pretty uniform.

That being said, reconsider your options.
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Excuse me.

Assuming there is any truth in this post - and we assume that with everything we read on the forum - then whether the person posting is the person with the disease himself or his wife, who has heart disease, we are talking about a couple who are in a dreadful situation.

Insurance fraud is wrong. Attempting to disguise suicide is fraught with risks, and not only the risk of being discovered in insurance fraud. And in any case suicide itself, medically assisted or not, is a terrible thing. Even if suicide is state-sanctioned and supervised and, all things considered, the best option available for a person - that's STILL terrible, in itself, that the best option for someone is to take his own life.

I must admit it didn't cross my mind that someone could be investigating our attitude to insurance fraud and whether we'd enthusiastically endorse it, or advise posters on brilliant ways to go about it. But since we're not like that, just as we're not fond of people hiding wealth from Medicaid or destroying inconvenient paperwork, why does it matter?

Personal criticisms aimed at the OP: before you address comments to him, please go to:
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