My FIL has 24/7 in-home care but ready for a nursing home (mind completely gone, isn't mobile, can't feed himself, declining rapidly). MIL is suffering from self neglect, is home bound and has taken up residency in a small room which has all made for terrible living conditions. She's spending 23+ hours/day in there and I just learned she is now urinating in the closet (been incontinent a long time). She's in terrible health, has lost a lot of weight, refuses to see doctors (so no formal diagnosis), has dementia that's getting worse, and will not accept anything other than meals from the help. She also has many episodes in which she loses it, freaks out and is verbally abusive. MIL has been bouncing checks a long time due to confusion, forgot to pay insurance/got cancelled/paying huge claim out of pocket, and I believe the dhtr is abusing her mom’s credit card (7K bill – ironically I think the dhtr is also being taken advantage of). I get insane updates from the workers (all of whom will attest to everything and more).
I'm clearly needing to take over all finances, but my MIL refuses to discuss anything with me. Since she spends so much time in that room, I'm not able to go in and search for all the financial stuff. I feel the only way I can do this is to get an attorney and go through the courts to get a court ordered exam (in home) to get a diagnosis which could acompany the POA thus making it much easier to take over. I've also thought about getting APS involved for an assessment to at least document her self neglect and mental state, but I'm worried that might result in a court appointed guardian.
I approached their bank with the POA but they said their legal dpt would have to do their due diligence and would call her. I know this would result in a lot of confusion on her part (she’s now confusing the POA with a will) and will probably involve her freaking out, but there's a slight chance she'd be lucid enough to simply say it's not valid. Then it’d be back to the drawing board. This is why I'd like a diagnosis that could accompany the POA.
FYI I'm a widow, only other family is their dhtr who's very dependent on them (I'll be her trustee upon their death). And to make matters worse, that daughter is most unpleasant and also extremely verbally abusive to the help. And the help is about to quit saying FIL needs more care than they feel comfortable providing, hence good timing to get my FIL in a home, which is another complicated issue. I think getting MIL declared incompetent would help here. I'm backup to his wife on his durable POA. Unfortunately, neither have medical POA's or directives.
ANY INSIGHT / SUGGESTIONS? Thank you
If you have legal POA documents done by a lawyer, I don't see how there is any problem here with the bank needing to review them or call your MIL. When I had to activate the durable POA for my father, I took the documents walked right into his bank ad told them that I had to make new bank accounts and transfer all of his funds into the new accounts. Then I went to the SS office and called the company who handled the pensions. I Showed the Ss people the POA papers and told them I had to become his Payee and that they needed to start depositing his money into the new account. They did it immediately. So did the pension people. I had a little more hassle with the credit card company until I told them that his girlfriend was fraudulently using his credit card and since the call was being recorded by both parties it is proof that I am warning them about it and as POA I will not authorize payment for fraudulent charges.
So someone at the bank is yanking your chain. When the bank, Social Security Administration, and credit card companies do their 'due dilligence' on POA documents, they call the lawyer or law firm that made the documents. Not the person they are for.
You would do well to call the lawyer who made them up and talk to him.
In the meantime, the bank and the credit card company can freeze the accounts while the 'due dilligence' is being done. This way the daughter cannot take their money.
Most definitely you should call APS on this situation. Both your FIL and your MIL belong in a nursing home.
If you have to, you can do an ER dump. Which is take both of them to the hospital ER and ask for a 'Social Admit' (be sure to use this term). They will send down a social worker to speak to you. This is when you tell them what's going on. The going to the bathroom in the closet, the completely invalid FIL, the loser daughter who is dependent on them and exploiting them financially. That they are an unsafe discharge. Call an ambulance and do as Alva is saying. Tell them you think your MIL is having a stroke.
The hospital will expediate getting them both into a nursing home. They will keep them admitted into the hospital until a place is found for them.
I 1000% credit the collective hive mind here with teaching me that mantra and I in turn drilled it into my DH, SIL and BIL's heads. I know they all thought I was crazy and several times when I wasn't at the hospital no one used those words. This last time when FIL was transported back at Thanksgiving - I didn't take any chances - before we could even get to the hospital - I called and got his assigned Staff Nurse and spoke to him at length about the situation and told him specifically that he was an "unsafe discharge" before we got off of the phone.
It was not even an hour before my SIL - who is the first emergency contact on FIL's portal - got a call from the hospital social worker - to talk about what was going on and what we needed to do next. They take those words seriously. When you say that, they recognize that you are telling them that you can't/won't take the patient home. And that you need help.
Your other option is to call APS and tell them it is emergent.
Maintain the ruse until you are in the ER examination room. Then tell the examining doctor what she is doing, and that she has no diagnosis, and you have no idea what is wrong. But whatEVER is wrong she cannot return home ALONE (stressed).
Try all you can to get her admitted, including telling them she cannot return to her home as she is unsafe and it would constitute an "unsafe discharge".
This will get admit and testing.
Then call in the hospital social worker. Stay on this one. Ask for one and keep asking. You need placement and discharge planning and you need diagnosis most of all. Tell them she cannot safely return home. They likely can get you temporary guardianship in a 15 minute phone call to a judge. As an RN I saw this happen. Be ready to go to an elder law attorney if not on an emergent basis.
Meanwhile, during her hospitalization do see an elder law attorney to learn all you must do as POA. KNOW IF YOU WANT THIS as it will be a horrific crucible. I did POA and Trustee for my cooperative, loving, very organized brother who had to enter care after dx of probably early Lewy's dementia. This is a hard hard hard job. I wish more people would think before accepting a POA.
If you cannot do this, then resign the POA with that attorney and leave MIL management of assets (which will be complicated by division of assets and etc needed for the care of both FIL and MIL.
Might I ask where hubby, who is, I assume their son, is in all this? Is he gone and you are left with this?
I am so sorry. This is an awful mess on so many levels and I would leave it to the courts and paid fiduciary/guardians appointed by them. I couldn't manage this one. If you think you can I can only wish you the very best.