Mom has vascular dementia, moved her in to AL on 4/11/21. Am I doing the right thing by not answering her calls?

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Mom has vascular dementia, moved her in to AL on 4/11/21. Am I doing the right thing by not answering her calls?

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Am I doing the right thing by not answering her calls (10 times yesterday)? The RN says its better not to contact her for the first several days, so that she will learn to depend on the staff instead of me, but I feel horribly guilty! I did talk to her yesterday morning, she seemed much calmer, but was still asking when I was coming to get her. I just didn't answer her calls for the rest of the day yesterday. She hasn't called today yet, I'm praying that is a good sign. Somebody with experience tell me what you think. She's 82 with vascular dementia. She has been living right behind me in a tiny house, but I just can't let her be by herself any longer, and she is resistant to having in-home care. Tried that before, and she just wouldn't answer the door to let them in. She thinks she is absolutely fine. ???

Assisted Living Care Decisions Vascular Dementia

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Sad as it is to not be able to do for mom what SHE wanted, if she wasn't accepting of in home help, and she was probably burning you out--you did the right thing.

Guilt is for someone who did something wrong, which you didn't do. You did what was necessary-and there will be an adjustment period.

Cut back to as many phone calls as YOU can handle--likely mom is unaware that she has overstepped bounds with that.

The RN has a lot more experience with this than you have had--let her lead you into this new 'norm'.

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Thank you. This is so hard. It helps to know there are people out there who have survived this and much worse.

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You are doing the right thing by transitioning her into AL and by not currently answering any or most of her calls. In the future when she asks "when" can she go home, you can tell her a semi-truth: it will be when her doctor approves it because she can do all her ADLs on her own. This is what we tell my MIL and it usually "satisfies" her.

It may be helpful to have a few planned visits with her when her AL is having some event or craft or function and you can go to these with her. I find that doing things there will her force her to go out and be engaged with other people, which would be good for her, but also you must have tempered expectations that she may not do any of it when you're not there. My MIL eventually decided to never get out of bed again, even though she could, and now she physically can't. She's in LTC and really didn't need to be so soon. Such a shame because even with some dementia and memory loss she is a sweet and light-hearted person and the staff loves her.

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Ok. Thanks. Yes, I really think this may be what happens to Mom. She is a very prideful, private person and has never had a lot of interaction with others. She has never had many hobbies, she used to play bridge, but no longer has the ability to keep up with the game. She's just bored and unhappy, and I haven't ever found one thing she will engage in. She will fold clothes and wash dishes. Haha! They are telling me she is out and about in the AL, but she's probably just looking for me. They tell me she is engaging with the other residents, but she's probably just being polite. She told me they were all elderly, and not 'her kind of people'. I'm so sad for her, and I pray she will get to the point where she can make a friend and be at least somewhat content. But I don't feel especially hopeful for that...thank you for your answer! Blessings to you!

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My mom has vascular dementia as well. It was really hard putting her in MC last August during the lock downs of the COIVD. My mom was unsafe because she thought she was fine to drive still. She suffers from delusions and hallucinations too. When her mind thinks she's done something or seen someone, there's no convincing her otherwise. I'm sure you are going throug some grief as well. It's hard to keep an eye on your LO, then nothing. I also grieved for my mom too. She'll never be the same. Yes, calling 10 times is too much. Don't feel guilty not calling. The main nurse will call if there's a true emergency. My mom suffers from sundowners. I always talk to her around that time to settle her mind. Otherwise, she panics thinking she needs to go home and fix dinner for my deceased dad and us kids who are 50 and older. Mornings are always good because they are more lucid. However, evenings are most lonely for them since activities of the day are done. That would be a good time to check in. It always helped me sleep better too. You can always call the nurse on duty to check how your mom is doing as well. Now that most places take visitors, I can now go sit with her some evening as get her through the sundowners. It's tough stuff and I wish the best for you and your mom.

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My mom had sundowner also. All her anger and bad memories would pour out in the evening. We found a secret that made a big difference. We made her place 'home to her. We put her blanket and quilt she loved on her bed. Brought over and hung her favorite pictures on the walls. Brought her clock and put it beside the bed. Her favorite chair and knit afghan were placed by bed and the light she used. It made a big difference and helped bring home to her.

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My Mom was in the last stages of her Dementia when I placed her. We told her she was going to a nice apartment and meeting new people. She adjusted well.

I see no problem in giving her a call in the morning and maybe one in the evening so she doesn't feel abandoned. My answer to her coming home question would be determined where her Dementia is. Do you feel you can say "Mom, this is your new home. You have so much more to do here. People to eat dinner with. New friends. Activities and entertainment" or a little white lie as suggested.

Yes she needs time to adjust. When u start visits, don't stay long. The word "home should not be mentioned even saying "well I am heading home" My daughter always said to Mom she was going to work. Satisfied Mom. Let the aides do the work.

The phone. This was one of the first things my Mom forgot how to use. She never got the nack of a cell phone even the simplest ones. So having one in the AL was not even a consideration. If she had one, though, phone calls 10x a day would not have happened. I would have eventually just let them go to VM. Calling her back if the message was important.

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Mom has forgotten how to use the phone also. I had programmed my number in when she was still at home, so that she only had to push one button. Unfortunately, its still programmed in there and I didn't think about changing it before we left her at AL.

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It will take time, but she will adjust. It probably is best to let her rely on the staff instead of you. I can totally understand why you feel guilty, as I'm sure I will when it's my turn. But we have to be kind to ourselves as well. She is where she needs to be and you know that. She will never agree and that has to be ok. I guess you need to try to find a way to come to terms with that.

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We all lose when dementia is involved. There's no rhyme or reason to it, and we have to stop applying our rules of normalcy to a condition that KNOWS nothing of normalcy at all, you know? It may seem 'cruel' to not take calls from mom, but in reality, she has to carve out HER new normal right now at the AL, and that means relying on the staff to help her and not on you. Take the advice of the RN and let her calls go to voicemail. Speak to her once a day, if need be, and that's it. Otherwise, you'll BOTH suffer with the endless questions about 'going home' and all that. You'll need a pat answer for her when you do need to address that question, and a good one is this, "When the doctor says you can go home, that's when we'll discuss it mom." In other words, she's in AL at the doctor's orders, so it's on HIM she's there, and so that's where she'll stay until he says otherwise.

Remember that she's there for safety reasons, as my mother is (94 and living in Memory Care) and so we don't have to worry that they're in grave danger. My mother is always angry at me about SOMETHING, too, so that's fine. Last night she told the CG to tell me she was 'sleeping' at 8 pm when I called b/c she was pissed about something else, as usual. That's fine, as long as she's okay! That's the goal: Keep them safe & secure and tell any white lies necessary to keep it that way.

Good luck; I know how tough this all is. I hope your mom adjusts well and settles in to her new AL soon!

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Great response! Thank tou!

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YES, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY DOING THE RIGHT THING, as long as the facility has asked you to refrain from contact as your mom takes the first difficult steps of adjusting to her new environment.

”Guilt” means deliberately ignoring the plea of someone for whom you could fix a problem by becoming g involved in it. YOU CAN’T solve her problem. You tried alternatives and none of them worked.

If you have chosen her placement with love and concern for her welfare, you have done fine. Be at peace that she is in a safe place where she will be cared for.

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Thank you, for your response. This is a wonderful forum. Thank you all for helping me feel better about my decisions.

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Call the facility for updates each day. They'll be happy to let you know how she's doing, and that'll help assuage your feelings of guilt until you can talk to her directly again.

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This was going to be part of my answer - check in with them to tone down YOUR anxiety!

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agingmother4343:

I'm so sorry that you are in this position also. It's very discouraging when the loose interest in everything. Best to you...

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I do not agree with some of this advice. Your mother is a human being and she is frightened. Comfort her. Dropping your mother off and letting the staff do all the work will lead to a poor adjustment. You should be answering most of her phone calls for the first two weeks; then begin to taper off and tell her you are not going to make every day about taking her phone calls. In my opinion, lying about things large and small only leads to mistrust, paranoia and agitation. There is a spare, diplomatic way to avoid lying in most situations. Your goal is to make your mother feel secure. Ask yourself how you would feel if you were admitted to a strange facility with many non-communicative residents and then be cut off from communication with your caregiver relative. Desperation and panic is the result. The RN who have you this advise is an insensitive, untrustworthy individual. I’m not at all surprised that you feel guilty. In your heart, you know what you are doing is not the correct approach. Follow your instincts and be there for your mother when she needs you most. It sounds like she is showing signs of settling in and chatting with her about what she is feeling and experiencing, no matter how valid or invalid you believe her thoughts to be, is a way to let her talk through her anxiety and come to terms with her changed circumstances.

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I don't think its helpful to judge. Perhaps suggest yes, but be gentle we are not all made of the hard stuff. Most of us do know what we need to do but just need to talk it through which is what this forum is for.

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The first three months are hell for a close family member, take it from me. But there is no other way to handle the situation. The patient is better off and will become acclimated. You will, too. Keep in steady communication with the facility is not only wise by keeping the facility on its toes but will ease your feelings of guilt, really your feelings of ‘doing nothing.’ You have done something. The right thing.

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Its not easy making that decision to put your mother into long-term care. Trust me I know. I personally chose to be there for my mother, answered her calls, visitations through her adjustment. My mothers adjustment wasn't smooth by any means. You take a stubborn, independent dutch woman that has no idea she needs help and place her somewhere she doesn't want to be. Well let me tell you. Many times I had to go in in the middle of the night, and leave work to help settle her down because she was being extremely difficult and sometimes unconsolable. It was hard on both of us. But you know what I don't regret a second of it. She was a strong influence through my life, so now it was my turn to be the strong support to her. I'm indifferent about your decision to follow the no contact as suggested. This type of support to someone transitioning isn't easy, you have to have a tough skin and be able to compartmentalize the feelings of guilt and the knowledge of making the right decision for your mother. Thats not easy and its not for everyone. I only recommend that if you chose to help her through this transition is to be strong, calm, understanding, agreeable and most of all honest. Help her understand while she still can that for her safety this is the right decision and that you know it will be tough but you'll be there to help her through it.

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I feel for you, I'm moving mum into a 2week respite care home soon and I'm struggling with that let alone permanently so I feel for you whole heartedly. With my advise head on , I would say listen to the nurses they do this all the time and I can understand they need to get your mum into a routine. Perhaps you could ask the nurses of you could set up a video call once a day at a set time so your mum gets into a routine but it's got to be heart wrenching for you I wish I could offer more help. It will all settle down, but may be a bit bumpy to start with. Hang in there 🙏

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That’s crazy !!! Why would you listen to that nurse ????
you should put yourself in your mothers’ shoes ... how would you feel being put in strange place with
people you don’t know and unable get intouch with your loved ones!!!
just because people have dementia doesn’t mean they’ve lost their minds and cannot think or feel anything !!! I feel so sorry for your mother that she doesn’t have a more
sensitive and sensible daughter.
that place sounds horrible ... insist on talking and visiting!!! And watch the care ... you may have to find another .

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She is asking for assistance in assessing the worker's instructions. She clearly expresses feeling overwhelmed. This is to be a place to come for support in untangling the maze of caring for our loved ones.

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I’m listening to everyone and I can’t believe the responses. I’m not judging, but there is no way I wouldn’t take my mom calls. You only get one mom. She is not your patient. You’re showing the staff how you treat her. It makes them treat her that way also!

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Oh I agree. Nursing homes are NOT safe. They are terrible!

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My mother (in Memory Care) was much the same. I would answer her calls at least once a day. I told my mother she has to stay there for a while because they can take good care of her and make sure she is safe. I'm not sure if she was convinced. Some people don't know they have dementia. They think they are capable of taking care of themselves. Try to be positive and joyfull at all times with her. When you visit, make the time quality time, as much as you can. Take her to places she enjoys, like a restaurant, or park, if you can. People with dementia talk of going "home" but for them it really means being the way they used to be, independent, in their own private space and doing things on their own.

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It is so helpful to clarify what home means to anyone who is sick and disabled. Sadly, many cannot go back to the old days, and it is wise for their caretakers to realize it and help them to do so. I hadn't thought of that in exactly that way myself, but it feels absolutely right.

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Do as the RN suggests and not answer her calls. Is she truly needed you, the staff would call you. Try to create a routine of calling her on certain days for a limited amount of time. Try visiting her on certain days for a limited amount of time. You should not feel guilty that you are helping her get used to a new life situation.

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Your mom is very traumatized. That is why she is calling.

Nursing homes are hardly safe. Getting scabies, lice, and bedsores are not uncommon. C. diff diarrhea is also common. The patients also fall, and sometimes one patient can assault another--some patients are violent. Other times the staff could assault the patient, or they neglect them having too many patients and only one CNA.

Happens all the time--so frequently there are lawyers specializing in that very thing and they make tons of money. Frankly I think they all should be shut down. Permanently.

I'm very thankful I never put my mom in one, but I also realize many people do not have a choice.

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She's not in a nursing home. She's in an Assisted Living facility that I thoroughly vetted before I put her there.

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You can talk to the nurse about wanting to have some kind of contact with her. Just explain you need to discuss it further because you are feeling bad about it. There may be some limited contact that would not be a problem. Or you may come to understand their reasoning. It would be a problem for everyone if your Mom focused constantly on reaching you and not checking out the new place. But it would be helpful to have some schedule that makes you more at ease. My MIL was in several good places. It still did not hurt for me to pop by almost daily, even very briefly, which was convenient, fortunately. Staff varies, things happen, it is good for everyone to know an involved family member is around. However, both you and your mother have your own life to manage now, separately as well as together, time to be about it.

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I know how guilt feels. It can be true guilt or guilt that someone has manipulated. I am certain that you can drop off flowers, a gift etc. to the facility right now and show her you're in her life. Leave it for her or have it delivered. On the note assure her of your love and you'll be seeing her soon.

Send her a picture in a card or a small album. "I'm going to be unavailable for a few days. I'll see you soon."

When I worked in Children's Ministry we visited a nursing home with the children. They would sing and tell stories or read a poem. One lady never received visitors, she wasn't eating or responding to staff. We saw her for 3 or 4 months and during that time she came alive.

We all intuitively know what's right - or wrong. Love will guide you. We understand and wish you well as you and your mom adjust.

NancyIS is going through this as well. Pull out what you can use and every opportunity you have reassure your love.

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bbooks5720 I feel for you. I don't have experience with dementia but I know you love your mother, you want to do what's best for her, but the advice you got from the facility makes you feel awful. In your situation I don't think I could just abandon my mom for the first several days either and would probably still call her once a day OR answer one or two of her calls each day (but not 10) to give you both a little more peace of mind. I'd also check in with the care staff regularly.

Moving a loved one into a facility is a difficult choice that most of us don't want to have to make but sometimes it's for the best. It's hard to know what to expect or how to best deal with the issues that come up. The other posters here gave some good advice. I hope your mom can adjust quickly and you can feel some peace. I would, however, continue asking staff for regular updates on her condition and care protocols, and visiting (if allowed) or calling her regularly (can you video chat?), and advocating on her behalf.

It made me sad to find some mean-spirited comments aimed at bbooks5720. Please, we don't come to this forum to be berated, we come because we are already confused, sad, overwhelmed, angry, feeling frustrated and helpless, feeling guilty, at our wits end, and truly in need of support and advice from others.

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The people who responded (haven't read them yet) with mean comments should be kicked off the site by moderators. You are absolutely correct. And while I don't have experience in this situation, I too would feel like it was abandonment and knowing in spite of best efforts many of these places leave something lacking in re to care, I would not feel any obligation to follow the RN's advice. WHo knows if she's right? I would maybe get into a habit of calling at a particular time of day or evening to check in. I never thought I would have to place my mother (or father) anywhere and still sit here hoping we do not have to make the decision, but can imagine how difficult it was and to do it.

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i would be visiting her every day and encouraging her to get around the facility - perhaps going to the meal with her and establishing her sitting with a nice group of women - that way when you are not there she can look around the room and not be intimidated and as lost. Also will avoid her ending up sitting with uncommunicative people and establishing this as her “spot”. As in high school they tend to sit with same people every meal.
also this way these ladies may look for her at other activities .
as for the phone calls - I would take at least some - not wanting her to feel abandoned - but not at her mealtimes or when she should be out and about - so find out when those time are. She is used to you helping her and now you are helping her to adjust . Also on calls - taper them off if there’s a lot .
Since we are about to start my grandson in Daycare - after being with me at her home while my daughter works remotely ,( so he’s had mama to breastfeed him every few hours ) . Imagine if the daycare said - just leave him for the first couple weeks- unimaginable right ??! We plan to ease him in by starting part time - he only knows like total FIVE people right now due to Covid so it will be rough , I think elderly can be like children - with their minds regressing and dependence on us. So I agree you mom needs to start depending on staff but she also still needs your love - and waiting two weeks for it is too long . Even when you go visit have mom call staff for assistance don’t do it yourself - at least for now .

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I would not be able to follow this advice. I cant imagine my mom feeling abandoned in a setting that most people detest to begin with. I would make every effort to be there for her in the beginning and then gradually not as much as she adjusts......ie my advice would be the opposite - spend more time in the beginning with mom and less as she adjusts.....but when i say "less" , i still mean trying to be in contact at a minimum DAILy ..whether it be thru in person visits or phone or video chats......think about all the people who died alone during covid where family was not allowed.....this is a gift to be able to be there for mom - whether physically or via phone....again, this is only my opinion and only what i would do for my own mother....everyone is differant....good luck.

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I would attempt to do what they suggest. Afterward I would limit calls to two a day, one in a.m. and one in p.m. Tell her this and stick to it so that indeed she goes to staff. Don't enable her to make this so much more difficult for both herself and for you. I wish you the best. So sorry you both have to deal with this.

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OK. Here's my experience. I HAVE been in constant contact with the facility. I have called my Mom once per day since she's been there (I couldn't completely follow the RN's advice) and other family members have been calling her once per day also.

Last night when I talked to her, we actually had a good conversation. She's still a bit confused, but seemed to be settling in. I think the RN actually gave me pretty good advice. It's probably been harder on me than her.

I talked to her about expressing her needs to the staff, and she seemed to understand that they are there to help her.

It's day by day right now. I am experiencing some sort of weird guilt/relief sort of thing where I went from doing LOTS of stuff for my Mom and constantly worrying about her safety day and night, while working, having a husband and 2 daughters one of which still lives at home, to nothing. I feel bereft...I think that is the proper word. I want those of you who may think I'm heartless to understand that I cannot properly care for my Mom anymore. She's in a good place where they can support her needs and she is safe.

This is one of the hardest decisions I have ever made in my life, and it was not made lightly.

Thanks to all of you who have given me words of support!

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In no way are you heartless. You are doing what is best for you, your family and your mother. You are still her primary caregiver. Know that if anything happens the facility will call you.

You are a loving caring daughter who is looking after the best for your mom. It was a brave thing to do. You have not abandoned her, you have given her a better life - look at it as if you were dropping a child off at college.

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Bbooks5720, thank you updating readers. I was thinking about adding my experience with placing my then 95-year-old dad with Alzheimer's into memory care, but also cautioning that everyone's specific situation is unique, so you should heed your own instincts and informed judgment. You've obviously navigated these hard decisions and conflicting emotions very well, so I now think my own experience is irrelevant. Best wishes for you, your mom and the rest of your family during this difficult time.

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Thank you!

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When we placed my MIL into an MC/AFL, the nurse told us to not visit for a couple of weeks but talking on the phone is fine “keep communicating” is what the nurse told us. So we did call her back once a day.

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Please free yourself from the guilt, you are absolutely doing the right thing. She does need to adjust to letting the staff be her caregivers. I think you did the right thing by talking to her just once. If you are concerned call the staff and see how things are going.

As for asking when you are going to take her home, that is a normal question from new residents. Just assure her that she is fine and is now home. A friend of mine says her mother would say to the staff just about everyday that she had to get ready because her husband (who had died years earlier) was coming to pick her up - none of the staff disabused her of this. My own father who willingly moved from his shared apartment with my mother in AL to SNF asked after a month in SNF "when can I go home?" Mom and I both told him he was home because he was too weak to move back in with mom.

My MIL had a habit of calling each of her 3 sons 10 - 15 times a day each with the same questions day after day after day. We moved her to AL and when she asked her youngest when she could go home she was told she was home. This is over 20 years ago now, but the staff kept her so busy she never called once in a couple of weeks to the point her sons began to wonder if something was wrong.

My advise is give it time. Talk to her no more than once a day for now. May be visit once a week letting her make friends and relying on the staff. This is not to say you are not still her primary caregiver, you oversee what is happening with her. Make the staff your allies in giving mom the best of care, but don't be afraid of approaching the higherups if there is a problem.

Good luck.

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thank you!

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This is a tough one and she has dementia. No matter who, I feel anyone taken out of heir home will have a very hard time once placed. I know I sure did. I went into assisted living because I could not walk. And while I am fiercely independent and l00% with it and still driving, working, you name it, I have never really adjusted but where can I go? So I am stuck. She is calling for reassurance, comfort. I personally would take ONE phone call a day to talk to her and if she starts in on you complaining or wanting to leave, etc. try distraction - but don't just totally ignore her. Just keep it to a bare minimum and if the phone call is upsetting, excuse yourself to answer the door, etc. and hang up. It will pass eventually.

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Hi Riley,

This is what I was going to write. One call a day. Set boundaries although do not totally ignore her.

I can only pray / hope to be as independent / accepting of what is as I get older and need assistance or different living situation.
You are a role model to me and I am sure, many others.
Questions:
(1) How did you become so independent?
(2) How were you brought up?
(3) How old are you?

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It’s ok to talk on phone as you will discover she’s more appreciative of you & nicer. You can encourage her to participate in therapy & activities. Then say you’ll talk tomorrow....Hugs 🤗

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Mom has vascular dementia, moved her in to AL on 4/11/21. Am I doing the right thing by not answering her calls?

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