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I. How We Work in Washington. Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services. APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
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V. Complaints. Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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Sounds like a very sudden decline... has he had a thorough medical exam? Often there are other illnesses that can cause dementia-like symptoms. When these are discounted then he should see a neurologist to confirm.
Please hire an elder care law specialist attorney near you. It won’t be free, however it will save your assets in the long run. They will usually do a consultation for free, so at least you can gain a better understanding of why you need an attorney. It may involve setting up a trust ( laws vary by state, so again, it’s imperative that you hire a local attorney who specializes in elder care.
Also, timing is important also. If you ever needed your spouse to qualify for Medicaid, Medicaid has a 5 yr look back for assets, for example you can’t “gift” assets to a loved one or friend within 5 yrs of applying for Medicaid. Medicaid will want those funds back to pay for your husbands care before Medicaid assistance will kick in. So you need to start protecting your assets now.
Again, there are many rules and they vary by state, so you see how a specialist attorney is needed to help you navigate through all this.
Talk to an Elder Care Attorney. It will be an investment but well worth it. And unless something medical happens where he needs nursing care a "nursing home" will not be the first step. The terms for facilities would be Independent Living. Not what you would be looking at. Assisted Living. I strongly advise against AL for a person with dementia as the AL is not a locked facility a person can wander out. Memory Care. For people that have cognitive issues and may wander. Skilled Nursing. For anyone of any cognition that needs some type of medical / nursing care. (anyone needing equipment to transfer them, anyone with any "tubes" and in many places anyone on oxygen)
I went to an elder law atty about my husband who has PD and Lewy Body. The atty told me I should liquidate our investments and apply all the money to our mortgage, then refi to get the lowest payment possible so I could cover it with my retirement income because a nursing home would take his SS and retirement income. As it is now, I could not pay all the bills with my retirement alone. He said an annuity would not be good in our situation because we have too much monthly income. As others have said, it varies by state so seek professional advice. Have we taken his advice? Not yet. We are thinking about selling the house as it is way too big for us. Then we could buy a condo or townhome. the atty also said as a last resort, we could get divorced and divide the assets before he goes into a facility. I don’t think I could do that. But it is an option. don’t try to figure it out yourself. You need professional advice.
Penguina, My heart goes out to you. If you still haven't followed your atty's advice, you may want to consider trying to find an attorney who would give a free consultation for a second opinion before moving forward. Some of what you are saying does not make sense to me, but I am not a professional. I am concerned you may have an atty without the experience you may need.
I see from your profile you are in SC. If you can not find a highly qualified atty nearby, with a free consultation, I highly recommend a trip to Lexington: Chasity Stratton at https://www.strattonreynolds.com/ Even if you don't use her, the website has a lot of insightful info as it applies to SC.
We consulted her and only paid once we agreed for her to provide certain services she offered... we could have walked away without hiring her at all. She is up on the latest law changes in SC. I was very impressed with her advice and felt our money was very well spent. She helped us prepare for the eventual need for VA and/or Medicaid benefits as well as probate issues which fortunately we haven't had to use any of these yet. Private message me if you would like more information.
AshleyWay, if someone doesn't have dementia and then suddenly acts like they do, it could be a possible urinary tract infection (UTI) which can mimic dementia.
See an attorney that specializing in elder trusts. They should also have accountants / or referrals to work with them / you. Every situation is different.
Unfortunately, there is a 5-year look back period for any sheltering or “gifting” of your funds prior to placing your spouse. My husband is in memory care, and I am using our life savings, paying $7,100 per month out of pocket. When there is $120k+ left, the VA will pay $2300 per month to help. Other than that, when your assets (except for your home and car) dwindle to $0, Medicaid will pay. A very unfair system where there are two spouses.
Lool up Community Resourse Spouse . The healthy spouse gets to keep the house and one car regardless of what they are worth. In Nevada the healthy spouse needs to spend down to $154,000 meaning he/she keeps that amt. Don't touch your home and lose your savings!! After spend down happens the patient applies for medicaid. Good Luck.
Depending on the state, the healthy spouse might be able to put anything over the state's maximum in her/his name into Medicaid-compliant annuities. Contact an elderlaw/estate planning attorney to see if this is a possibility for you. It *must* be done before the ill spouse requires Medicaid, though.
I'm dealing with a similar issue right now, although luckily, my husband is retired and still has alot of savings from his work retirement plan. He's been getting slower with normal-pressure hydrocephalus, a VP shunt, and Parkinson's symptoms over the last year. On 03/30/2024, he began falling more than usual, had electrolyte imbalance and was admitted to the hospital. He developed respiratory failure, I guess from pneumonia and weakness, within a day, was intubated, subsequently, given a tracheostomy, and has been ventilator-dependent since then. He was transferred to an LTAC to work on trying to get off the ventilator, but after 2 1/2 months there, they said he has to go to a skilled nursing facility that takes ventilators - there are very few of those, despite our living in a large city. After 1 night there, he got more respiratory distress than they could deal with, so they sent him back to the hospital where he still is. They seem to be saying he'll go back to the SNF next week. So far, we're OK financially, but I can imagine that his retirement funds will dwindle quickly if this goes on another year or so. Also, he's gotten so weak, he can't even sit on the side of the bed, much less a wheelchair for longer than a few minutes at the most. He always wanted to stay at home in his old age, but I can't imagine how that could be feasible, the way he is now. I'm new to this forum, so thank you for any advice.
Hi Wildgrape Welcome to the forum. To follow protocol it is best to start your own thread and ask a specific question. I’m sorry for you and your DH (dear husband) situation.
Just saw an elder care lawyer and our financial advisor this week (similar situation) and glad I did. You need professional guidance through this difficult process. Feel like I can finally breathe without having an anxiety attack. Would have had no idea how to handle this without their help. And now I can focus on my husband's recovery. Best of luck to you....
I recently saw 2 elder care attorneys and they gave me totally different options for Medicaid assistance. Both of which have serious downsides. Can you please tell me what you decided to do?
Your and your husbands "life savings" should be used for your care. Do not expect taxpayers to pay for care when you have the money to pay for it yourself. We have our own parents to pay for.
wow. just wow. I get what she was asking because I am in her shoes right now. When all of the savings is used up on one spouse what will be left for the spouse that remains? poverty? She wasn't trying to dodge paying a darn thing, just wondering how to protect herself!
If you're asking about applying for Medicaid to assist or pay for NH, money is considered for the at-home spouse to prevent that spouse from being impoverished. If life savings is considerable amount, you need to talk to elder atty who can explain how long you might be self pay for husband's NH care and at what point Medicaid would kick in. Lots of other things could come in to play, so seek legal council. Rules can be confusing and detailed. Atty can help you prevent costly errors and explain how it works in your state.
I agree with all the advice to consult with an elder care attorney. You need professional advice on how to protect your savings and still pay for his care.
Your life savings is supposed to be for your life expenses. Including medical expenses. Although you may not have anticipated and planned for nursing home care, we all have unexpected expenses at some time.
I know this is devastating emotionally. I'm sorry you are going through this. My husband was 53 when he went to a nursing home after a massive stroke which left him suddenly unable to walk, talk, or swallow solid foods. The day before he had taken an all day motorcycle ride with friends. It is devastating emotionally and financially. Be sure to talk frequently with a doctor you trust to get guidance on his condition and prognosis and care needs.
I'm fortunate in that my husband is retired military (USAF). He has his retirement pay, SS, and a 70% disability rating. I'm working on getting this up to 100%. This will qualify him to be placed in the VA system at no cost when the time comes. This will leave me with the investments we've made over the years as well as my SS. After he passes I will retain a small percentage of his VA pension as well as SS and his military retirement through spousal support. We also had the foresight to place many of our assets in a Trust for this very reason. If one goes before the other and uses up all resources it leaves the surviving spouse impoverished. I know there is a lot of resentment on this forum about placing finances and assets in Trusts. It's sad that the government in many states doesn't allow this any longer. What's the difference when one spouse spends down all the assets and leaves the other impoverished, they end up on Medicaid anyway.
He was diagnosed with Alzheimer's about 12 years ago. When I suspected something was amiss his neurologist assisted me in getting him into Cleveland Clinic Lou Ruvo Center for Bran Health. He's now on maximum medications. He's too far gone for one of the newer ones. He's not absorbing his food properly so shouldn't be on one of the stomach/brain medications. He's already had 1 transfusion as well as an iron transfusion and taking iron every other day. We're both fortunate that we have Medicare (Advantage) and Tricare for Life for our insurance so little outlay for medical expenses. We're so thankful he decided to go for the long haul.
He's now having falls. He fell once in the street. Fortunately, someone saw him go down and helped him up. I've lost count of how many times I've had to call 911 to get him up. He's too much for me to handle (I've had back surgery). He's taken me down once in one of his falls. I ended up with a CT to make sure I didn't have a bleed. I know the time to place him is inevitable with this horrible disease, but it's going to happen. As I've told my brother, "I'll know when it's time I have to throw in the towel".
Look up "Community Spouse". Depending on your state u have the right to keep your home untouched and one car. Any monies over$154,000 in Nv. Has to be spent down meaning u get to keep that amt. Your house and one car. Don't let the nursing home tell u otherwise. He can apply for medicaid after the spend down.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
This forum can guide you with certain issues but this is best left to a professional since laws vary in each state.
Good luck with this difficult situation.
Also, timing is important also. If you ever needed your spouse to qualify for Medicaid, Medicaid has a 5 yr look back for assets, for example you can’t “gift” assets to a loved one or friend within 5 yrs of applying for Medicaid. Medicaid will want those funds back to pay for your husbands care before Medicaid assistance will kick in. So you need to start protecting your assets now.
Again, there are many rules and they vary by state, so you see how a specialist attorney is needed to help you navigate through all this.
And unless something medical happens where he needs nursing care a "nursing home" will not be the first step.
The terms for facilities would be
Independent Living. Not what you would be looking at.
Assisted Living. I strongly advise against AL for a person with dementia as the AL is not a locked facility a person can wander out.
Memory Care. For people that have cognitive issues and may wander.
Skilled Nursing. For anyone of any cognition that needs some type of medical / nursing care. (anyone needing equipment to transfer them, anyone with any "tubes" and in many places anyone on oxygen)
Have we taken his advice? Not yet. We are thinking about selling the house as it is way too big for us. Then we could buy a condo or townhome.
the atty also said as a last resort, we could get divorced and divide the assets before he goes into a facility. I don’t think I could do that. But it is an option.
don’t try to figure it out yourself. You need professional advice.
I see from your profile you are in SC. If you can not find a highly qualified atty nearby, with a free consultation, I highly recommend a trip to Lexington: Chasity Stratton at https://www.strattonreynolds.com/ Even if you don't use her, the website has a lot of insightful info as it applies to SC.
We consulted her and only paid once we agreed for her to provide certain services she offered... we could have walked away without hiring her at all. She is up on the latest law changes in SC. I was very impressed with her advice and felt our money was very well spent. She helped us prepare for the eventual need for VA and/or Medicaid benefits as well as probate issues which fortunately we haven't had to use any of these yet. Private message me if you would like more information.
They should also have accountants / or referrals to work with them / you.
Every situation is different.
Gena / Touch Matters
it also depends on what state you live in.
Welcome to the forum. To follow protocol it is best to start your own thread and ask a specific question. I’m sorry for you and your DH (dear husband) situation.
If life savings is considerable amount, you need to talk to elder atty who can explain how long you might be self pay for husband's NH care and at what point Medicaid would kick in. Lots of other things could come in to play, so seek legal council. Rules can be confusing and detailed. Atty can help you prevent costly errors and explain how it works in your state.
Your life savings is supposed to be for your life expenses. Including medical expenses. Although you may not have anticipated and planned for nursing home care, we all have unexpected expenses at some time.
I know this is devastating emotionally. I'm sorry you are going through this.
My husband was 53 when he went to a nursing home after a massive stroke which left him suddenly unable to walk, talk, or swallow solid foods. The day before he had taken an all day motorcycle ride with friends.
It is devastating emotionally and financially. Be sure to talk frequently with a doctor you trust to get guidance on his condition and prognosis and care needs.
He was diagnosed with Alzheimer's about 12 years ago. When I suspected something was amiss his neurologist assisted me in getting him into Cleveland Clinic Lou Ruvo Center for Bran Health. He's now on maximum medications. He's too far gone for one of the newer ones. He's not absorbing his food properly so shouldn't be on one of the stomach/brain medications. He's already had 1 transfusion as well as an iron transfusion and taking iron every other day. We're both fortunate that we have Medicare (Advantage) and Tricare for Life for our insurance so little outlay for medical expenses. We're so thankful he decided to go for the long haul.
He's now having falls. He fell once in the street. Fortunately, someone saw him go down and helped him up. I've lost count of how many times I've had to call 911 to get him up. He's too much for me to handle (I've had back surgery). He's taken me down once in one of his falls. I ended up with a CT to make sure I didn't have a bleed. I know the time to place him is inevitable with this horrible disease, but it's going to happen. As I've told my brother, "I'll know when it's time I have to throw in the towel".