Follow
Share
Read More
This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
4 5 6 7 8
Ok my friends and I mean that - I know I need therapy and I’m going to get treatment. Let me digest all of this wonderful input, and I’ll get back to you soon. Love you guys!
PS: I do voice my opinion and can be very verbal, and so can my husband, but we agreed to back off sometimes. My mother says “What a mouth you have, but she says I love you so much. I know she loves me and I do love her too, but I think I’m petrified about what my future will look like!
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
Take care, Max. Take time to process the information posted on your thread.
(1)
Report
See 3 more replies
Anyone else DRAINED tonight? I am. My mother does admit I’m the best daughter and she’s right, I have to say. I’m always thinking about everyone and how I can please everyone even strangers for gods sake!
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
golden23 Jan 2023
Always thinking of others, wanting to please others

At what cost to yourself, Max? You said you are exhausted emotionally, mentally and physically, I don't wonder at that.
(4)
Report
Sorry guys, I need to talk. I called my mom a COMMANDER today! and also told her just put me back in your womb.
She once again said I bet you can’t wait to leave us and I said of course I can’t. Did you forget I have a husband for 36 years and a home? She actually laughed. Really, it’s funny?
Helpful Answer (0)
Report
golden23 Jan 2023
Max you are in this toxic dance with your mother, Calling each other names, getting alternately mad and "loving" with each other, expecting her to act differently than she always has. She burns hot and cold and sends you into an emotional tizzy. What's new? It is how she is. I don't see love between you two. You taunt one another. I suspect you have a very deep seated anger at your mother and are tied to her through that.
(5)
Report
See 3 more replies
I'm sorry that you are going through this. I'm glad you found us.

I would plan for my exit if you haven't already and leave. You have a husband that you have pledged your life and your future to.

Will she allow you to talk to her primary care doctor or a social worker? Go and get ideas from them on how others have dealt with similar situations. You don't mention what part your Dad plays into all of this.

If he is okay for you to leave immediately, then leave.

You have a kind heart and your Mom is making sure she takes full advantage of it. Don't....you need a lot of that heart for yourself and your husband and others in your family.

P.S. It really sounds like she is not happy with herself, therefore, she thinks she can be happy by being demanding to be pampered. The twist where she showers you with compliments after demand and demand and demand. That's classic emotional abuse.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report

Maximus, Google the term "people pleaser".

You are in a co-dependent, enmeshed relationship with your family. Look up those terms.

In some cultures, that is the norm. In the U.S., it is not.

Because you are, and have been, supporting your parents for many years, you may not be able to disentangle from this web easily.

Conside posting the financial situation on www.bogleheads.org, or seek the advice of an elder law attorney who as a social worker on staff. They exist, especially in Florida.
Helpful Answer (3)
Report

I’m just thinking about some things- both parents never had to care for their parents. My mom was 50 when her mother died and my dad and his mom were not on good terms. They had a free life and were able to do whatever they wanted to without being tied down. My husband and I do not have to make new memories with them - any more memories and our heads are going to burst. I’m saying this because I read a post with a woman saying she didn’t mind eventually becoming her father’s caregiver because they got close and made so many memories together when he was old. She didn’t spend every waking moment with her father. I’m just venting. I promise when I go home, I’m going to do what I have to - thanks to everyone here!
Helpful Answer (4)
Report
golden23 Jan 2023
Max - that's a very good thing to realize. Well done! You and your husband need time to yourselves. That's one of the things you have been saying. You've paid your dues as a daughter and the price has been high - too high. You and hub can go overseas and enjoy your retirement and recover. Your parents need to stay here and be cared for by other people either in their home or a facility.
(4)
Report
See 2 more replies
Drained: deprived of strength & vitality.

When I feel like that, I take a nap, listen to music, soak in a hot bath, take a relaxing walk by the creek alone. (Must admit to watching some junk on TV too).

Depending on what stage of life this was, sometimes I just had to push through. Nap may have been a quick 5 mins in the car (parked!) before the school run.

These days I take more time to stop & revive. I CHOOSE to do so.

Self-care.
Valuing ourselves.
Taking responsibility for our own needs.

Max, what did you do for yourself for restoration after your draining day?

It's just a small snapshot of one day, but it may show you a lot. That old saying: Lead, Follow, Get (out of the way).

Lead your own day, follow everyone's plan or get away for a walk, nap, bath.
Helpful Answer (3)
Report

The much bigger picture is kind of the same..

* Lead: Organise more help for your folks.
* Follow: go along with Mom & Dad's plan (or lack of..). They want XYZ, so you provide it.
* Get: go home

It really comes down to what you want more & what you are more afraid of.

To lead you will benefit from therapy to support you while you make changes.

Follow will see you entrenched as maid & wiper.

Get going home may bring feelings of guilt or separation anxiety. Also resentment at putting your life constantly on hold - arranging dogcare, flying in every few weeks/months for every new crises. Getting stuck each time.

Inaction will result in the default existing pattern of Follow - but change of mind is possible at any time.
Helpful Answer (3)
Report
JoAnn29 Jan 2023
I think this all has been done and Mom refuses help other than Max. Home definitely.
(2)
Report
I agree, do not engage Mom. Just ignore her. Or call ur DH and tell him to pick u up this Sat. I really don't think ur going to make it till the 28th. When he comes, go to a Motel if he needs a day of rest before starting back. Do not stay at your parents. Say goodbye and don't come back if anything drive out of town for that motel.

I looked back on a old post from 2015 and then u were 50. So now your going on 58, by AARP terms your a senior. You have been thru breast cancer and from what I understand, the chemo effects you for quite a long time. 58 is not old but those treatments took a lot out of you. I have heard energy levels and strength don't always come back. You are probably going to need to continue to pay for your parents mortgage, hard to stop now. But when one of them passes, the other will need to go into somekind of care.

I know they are in their 90s, bad time to start sticking up for yourself. But you need to. You may need to allow the State to take over their care eventually. You are only one person with health problems of her own that may have been brought on by the stress ur under.you need to get rid of that stress. You need to find the tools to deal with Mom. YOU need to have boundries. Mom will try to cross them but you need to stand firm. Sorry Mom, this is how it needs to be. Really, it gets me that your Mom is so formidable with you, but afraid of your brother.
Helpful Answer (6)
Report

Manimus, I hope you are using this next 7 days in Florida to organize a consult with a home care agency, look at ALs and rehab centers and book an appointment with an Elder Law attorney.

Don't sit around sparring with mom. It's bad for your health. And hers.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
maximus1 Jan 2023
Barb - My husband and I will be doing research when we go home. He’s really good at this stuff. He did plenty of research for my dad’s cancer and for mine. He has done research for my healthcare in Europe and still learning, so we’ll start researching for mom and dad when we’re together. He’s extremely bright and will understand more than I can. Thanks❤️
(1)
Report
JoAnn29 I’m actually will be 63 in March. Yes, still suffering side effects of chemo and my aromatase inhibitor (anti-cancer medicine), which I will be on for another 8 years. Ok, told mom that my husband will only be staying overnight then we’re leaving. I’ll post what her response was soon. Also, she didn’t remember my husband spent 1 1/2 months visiting with her. Dementia?
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
golden23 Jan 2023
Max it would be good to write down these thing about your mother and give them to her doctor. She may be developing dementia. My daughter is still very tired from cancer treatment and also still on drugs. It is imperative for your health that you reduce stress in your life which basically means reducing contact with your mother as she is the major cause of stress for you.
(1)
Report
I also forgot to tell you she didn’t remember she was hospitalized over the holiday.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

So, Maximus, what are you doing there in Florida, if not setting up services for your parents?

What happens if mom strokes out (or pretends to) the day before you leave?

You have the gift of time right now. Use it to find good facilities.

I can can tell you from person experience that the hospital your mom (or dad) is admitted to wants to know where you want your parent sent for rehab. You need to know where the places are that are acceptable.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

Is it possible to shift focus?

Move the focus away from what Mom says, thinks or even remembers (although concerning). This is all outside your control.

Focus in what is INside your control.

1. Report your concerns (in writing) to Mom's Doctor.
2. Packing your bag.
3. Considering asking DH to book a local hotel for his first night back & go join him per JoAnn's excellent suggestion.

If your skillset is not research, that's ok. We all have our different talents. Yours may be a daily call for emotional support (from your home).
Helpful Answer (1)
Report

Question: If mom asks me when I’ll be returning, what should I say? My Dad’s 95th birthday is 2/23 - I haven’t brought it too her attention. Remember I spend every darn occasion with them because they occur every 2 months or so and that’s what this entire post is about- me saying NO! I have so much to do when I return home. I probably will be going for Mother’s Day, so she’ll just have to miss me. Fathers Day will be a NO this year!
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Beatty Jan 2023
Answer "Soon" ❤️

Her asking is her worry, her separation anxiety.
Meet Emotion with Emotion.

A *factual date* is not required. Be vague + emotive eg Soon. I'll be looking forward to it. As soon as it's possible.

Even the best promise in the world can get derailed anyway Eg Covid
(2)
Report
See 5 more replies
Thanks❤️
Helpful Answer (1)
Report

"Mom, I'm going home to find out my treatment options. I have no idea when I'll be able to come back. I think you should call this home care agency and have someone come in to look after you and dad."

Have you got your doctor's appointment set up?
Helpful Answer (3)
Report

Ok everyone-I will be telling you what I told her yesterday later- don’t have time. My mom will just have to scream her pretty head off (which she is) - I need to have my papillon puppy trained so we will be able to get on a plane to Europe when my husband retires - I’m talking about 1 1/2 years from now. That’s why I’m on this forum, because I’m frantic! My parents have lived a long carefree life doing what they wanted to - never had to provide care for their parents-they said they have no regrets because they accomplished everything they wanted to in life. Are they kidding us? Will tell you later. But for now - NO guys I’M NOT SEEING MY DAD FOR HIS BIRTHDAY! Thanks for making me strong!
Helpful Answer (6)
Report
ZippyZee Jan 2023
If you’re over the age of 21 a birthday is just another day, so don’t worry about that.
(3)
Report
First, I'm so sorry your going through this. We're in good company but it feels very lonely sometimes... Much to unpack here, like the guilt, but maybe this will help.
I also had concerns that mom's "wiping" wasn't sufficient. I bought few gadgets to help, none did. Until
the bidet! It was less than $50 and after some fun, thoughtful, careful, introduction, it's been great. Specifically designed for women, but everyone can use, cleans front and "back"! My mom also struggles with mobility and weight so had to tweak things just a little for access to controls but it was no problem. With a little practice and humor this wonderful invention helped!
They seem "scary" at first but I assure you after 2,3 times you wonder how you did without and if we lived in a European country we probably would've grown up with one.
So that's my advise, I sincerely hope it helps you or someone else. We need all the help and successes we can get.
Btw, I got it on Amazon and got one for myself!

Much love, peace & support,

Carol's youngest, Lisa ♥
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

I forget how far away you are. Your problem is you worry before it happens. First, deal with now. You have told Mom your leaving on the 28th. No need to keep reminding her. No need to keep saying "Mom you know I am leaving on the 28th, so you need to be able to do this and that" She thinks if she doesn't do this and that you will have to stay. You only have a week. (really think u should go home tomorrow) IGNORE HER! She will have to do it when u leave or Dad will have to do it. They may realize that they need help.

When Mom asks when you coming back say at this point say you have no idea. If she pushes it say "Mom give me a break. I have been here for two months. Give me a chance to get used to being home and dealing with Doctors before asking that question." Then when you get home and she asks say "Mom I cannot answer that but when I decide I am coming a certain time, then I will call u"

Do not tell her you won't be coming for Dads birthday now. Wait till u get home and tell her in one of your ph calls but not the one you make to tell her ur home. When u tell her just say "sorry, no. After 2 months staying with you, I have too much to catch up on."
Really, the 23rd is only about 3 weeks after you left.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Beatty Jan 2023
"Do not tell her you won't be coming for Dads birthday now".

This.

This is the opportunity to start CHANGING the communication style right here.

Do NOT tell her.

Unless you can be bold & tell her plain.

Either way, short confident answers work well.
Long waffling, wavering worries just invite trouble.

Like poking a wasp nest. Wasps come out.
(2)
Report
How are you doing, Max? Count down to Jan 28th!
Helpful Answer (3)
Report
JoAnn29 Jan 2023
Count down...4 more days.
(3)
Report
Hi Guys, Thanks for writing. I have a quick question before I update you in another post what my mom told me. Ok - question - my mom has been eating salty foods again and her ankles and legs swelled. If she says when are you coming back or you don’t care about me or whatever - what should I say something like well if you abuse yourself then you will be sacrificing my life.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Hothouseflower Jan 2023
No, I would not say that. Just leave on 1/28. You can’t stop her from eating what she wants. The only joy left for a 90 year old is enjoying food. Let her eat whatever she wants. So she dies happy at 91 instead of 100. Is that really such a bad thing?
(10)
Report
Maximus, you are not getting it.

This is not about what snappy comeback to make to your mom.

This is about you becoming single minded in your effort to DISENGAGE from "discussions".

The only way to not get manipulated by your mother is to disengage. Stop responding to her provocations.

She is an adult. You are an adult.

You are two separate people. How she eats is no concern of yours and should have no bearing on your coming and going.

If mom needs supervision of her food intake, someone to prepare healthy meals for her and someone to wipe her, there are loads of good ALs in Florida. There are also numerous home health care agencies.

This simply is NOT your job.

You are returning home on January 28th. No further conversation about that.
Helpful Answer (8)
Report
Frebrowser Jan 2023
Agreed. There is no comeback that will slip past her need to have things her way.

If she ever had the ability to accept “No.” for an answer, it may be gone now, lost to mental illness and/or cognitive decline.

So she gets to make bad choices for herself, but not for her daughter, who should go home on time, offer assistance with sourcing professional care in her periodic phone calls, and prepare to insist on a needs assessment and safe discharge if/when the fluid retention leads to an ER visit and hospitalization for shortness of breath.
(3)
Report
See 1 more reply
Max,

It doesn’t really matter what your mom has to say about this or that situation.

Don’t aggravate yourself with thoughts of what your mom may or may not say to you.

It is senseless to worry about something that hasn’t happened or may not happen.

Spend your time wisely by focusing on having everything ready for you to leave on schedule. Don’t procrastinate. Don’t delay. It’s time to go back home.

Are you concerned that your mom won’t be understanding about you going back home?

Even if she is unpleasant, you can’t stop her from feeling as she does. Allow her to feel however she wants to even though it may make you uncomfortable. Don’t argue with her. You aren’t going to change her mind. Say goodbye, and leave.

Children have been doing the opposite of what their parents have desired since the beginning of time. Why should you break this trend? 😊
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Maximus, there's a concept you might think about. It's called "swooping"--what those of us who think we need to fix everything in the world, keep everyone happy and respond to every crisis do on a regular basis.

Here's the thing. Swooping leads to resentment. It disables the person you are "helping" because it robs them of autonomy, free choice and the ability to learn problem solving skills for themselves.

You can't be responsible another person's happiness. You can't care more about their health than they do.

Your parents have made some pretty awful choices in their lives; from what you've written, they have never endured any of the consequences because you've swooped in and saved them every time.

Has that worked out for you?

Your dad sounds mentally okay, yes? Give him the names of some Home Health agencies to call to set up services. Take a look at some ALs on your own so you can help your parents choose where to go for rehab when the next crisis occurs.

Keep in touch by phone and when the next crisis happens, DO NOT get on a plane. Call the hospital and talk to Discharge Planning on Day One. Your mantra should be "my mother is no longer safe at home".
Helpful Answer (4)
Report
NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
Home health is an excellent suggestion! My mom actually did quite well in home health. She definitely improved her strength and balance.

She loved the good looking PT who played Sinatra for her to exercise to. She had success with the OT as well.

She enjoyed visiting with the aides and nurses. I felt that it was mentally stimulating as much as it was physically enriching for her.
(2)
Report
Thanks everyone- great advice! I was not feeling good today - had a slight migraine- seems like they’re returning after they stopped after the breast cancer. Could be stress. My lower spine is hurting from pulling out the bed and I haven’t slept good for 2 months. My mom said her knees and shoulder hurt so I replied so does mine. She also said to me so you’re going home and you must want to run away from us and I replied - I Iove you and will miss you, but I miss my husband and home. I explained that my husband will be spending Friday night and leaving Saturday and she said that’s not nice! My father and I had to explain to her that he has a job and he cannot concentrate in their place and he needs to get home for work on Monday and go into the office. I said to her are you ok with getting dressed by yourself and she replied oh yes, I was just taking advantage of the fact that you were here - Is she kidding me? Now she tells me that?! P.S. No bathroom issues either! Sorry for such details.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
Yay! Progress with the bathroom. That’s terrific, Max.

Your dad sounds like he is on board with your plan. He’s seems to be supportive of you.

I am sorry about your headaches returning. It will be wonderful to sleep in your own bed when you return home.

Keep reminding yourself that it doesn’t matter what she says or feels. That’s your mom just being your mom, right? Why would you expect anything differently from her at this point in her life? She’s set in her ways.
(3)
Report
See 1 more reply
Max, why would your mother abusing herself be sacrificing your life? I don't get that. and I wouldn't say that at all or do that.

It is her choice as to what she eats. If she chooses to eat things that are not good for her, she will suffer the consequences. She knows that. You don't have to say anything at all. Don't let her use this to manipulate you.

If you have decided to stay longer with her in the past because she is not looking after herself you have allowed her to control you. But you can't, in fact, control her can you?

This is about saying "No" to being manipulated and controlled by your mother.

Go home and get on with your own life no matter what she says or does. She has choices and so do you.

Truthfully I don't think most of us care what your mother has said or done. her behaviour and your behaviour are not tied together. You are not Siamese twins. But how you feel about what she says is another matter.

What we care about is you and you making healthier choices for yourself. You have come here looking for support and advice. We are concerned for you primarily. Help from AL or agencies is available for your mum.

I get that your mother saying you don't care for her isn't easy to hear. How does that tie in with her saying you are the best daughter? She uses whatever words she thinks will get you to do what she wants you to do. Don't you see that?

I think you do care for her, but you also care for yourself or you wouldn't be here. So don't engage in any more backbiting. It's not good for either of you. You don't have to justify your decisions. You can disengage/ignore/walk away from whatever she is saying. You are going home on Jan 28. End of story. It really doesn't matter what she says or does. You have made your decision. She doesn't have to like her. That's OK that's her.

I think you experience a lot of anxiety related to your mother. You were brought up to never say "No" to her. I expect you weren't allowed to express anger either. But you are an adult now. What harmed you as a child is not your fault, but your healing as an adult is your responsibility.

Learning to disengage from your mother so she is no more the center of your universe is part of your healing. So is saying "No" and refusing to be drawn into or initiate these discussions. Change the subject, talk about something neutral. Give up trying to change your mother or get her approval. The only person you can change is yourself.

(((((Hugs)))) and prayers for you.

Max - Just read your post - not surprised she can manage by herself. She has been manipulating you.

Barb - swooping - great description
Helpful Answer (4)
Report

Hey, Max

My therapist had me role play if I became nervous about certain situations.

If you want to practice with any of us, we can do that.

I was super fortunate to have a great therapist who didn’t let me off the hook when I would get sidetracked.

You know, for those of us who grew up in dysfunctional families, the abnormal behavior became our normal. So, it’s not unusual to have to practice what is normal behavior as long as it takes for it to feel correct to us.

We process at our own pace, due to our own individual circumstances. Some people may move along a bit faster but they shouldn’t make those who have moved a bit slower feel badly. What does that accomplish other than making a person feel crappier than they already do.

So, I hope that you know that you have many who support you. Forget about any harsher criticism if it is overwhelming for you. Know that everyone does care about your success and each person expresses their views in their own way.

Wishing you all the best.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report

If you met my parents you would never believe their ages. They don’t look or sound like they are in their 90’s. This is why I’m still not understanding how they haven’t mellowed. Even to this day, they will cook and entertain their friends. They’re amazing, but my husband and I are different people and we are drained from them. When we leave Florida after visiting, we need another vacation. Years ago, my husband and I every Friday night for 4 years after working all day, would drive to their country home in the dark, on dangerous mountain roads. We wanted to sleep until 8 am, but my dad would get up at 4 am and start breakfast. It drove him insane that we were still in bed, so he would bang on the ceiling with a broomstick to get us up. He was retired from the airlines at the time and when he was flying internationally, he always had a lot of time off because he had seniority (Captain) - never had to work, as we call it, a regular job. My parents are still crazy that way! It never ends! This is why I’m frantic about caring for them.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
NeedHelpWithMom Jan 2023
I have a cousin who just turned 100 and she is one of the most amazing, optimistic people that I have ever known.

She has outlived two of her kids. She does live in a senior apartment building, not assisted living, still cooking and cleaning. No walker or cane. Exercises with her group of friends, then goes out for lunch too.

She still attends Mass and helps the other “old people” in her apartment building out when they need assistance!

She will speak about what she plans to do next year! LOL 😆

I have never once heard her say, “Lord willing, blah, blah, blah.”

She bakes fruit cakes just like my great aunts did to give away for the holidays. Let me tell you, I think she is adding more rum each year to her recipe!

Some people are young at heart!
(4)
Report
See 1 more reply
Feeling a bit hippy here but here we go...

Move to the centre of the triangle.

The three corners contain patterns of behaviour: Swooper (Fixer), Victim & Persecuter.

When you feel charged to react, magnetised, pulled into one of the corners - resist!
Stay neutral in the centre.
Be like Switzerland.

When Mom takes the Victim role, says poor me, you're leaving etc.. she wants you to take the Fixer role. To stay & fix her problems.

When Mom says you don't care about me, your husband is mean etc she has taken the Victim role again. This time making you/husband out to be Persecutors.

It's a merry dance of communication. Around the triangle it goes, like magnets pushing each other.

The way to stop being controlled like this, to be pushed around like a magnet, is to move to the centre.

Be neutral. Dis-engage.

It takes practice.
(I am still leaning).
Helpful Answer (12)
Report
polarbear Jan 2023
Beatty - I really like the way you organize thoughts, so logically and easily understood. You're so good at drawing pictures with words. You're probably my 2nd favorite writer on this forum.
(3)
Report
See 1 more reply
4 5 6 7 8
This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
Ask a Question
Subscribe to
Our Newsletter