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My mother's POA is uneducated and vindictive. He has hired a lawyer to rep my mother. My mother has never heard of the lawyer. Her POA has spent at least 3500.00 on the lawyer so far. Mom forced to sell home, enter NH, now she is recovered, wants to go home, family has screwed her by applying for Medicaid, now she can't go back, apparently. Same lawyer has allowed POA to give my brother a home and a car that belong to my mother. POA is also executor of mom's will. POA states he will change her will and life insurance beneficiaries to suit himself, leave mom's money/assets/basic life ins benefit, if there is any, to his own kids. States he will cancel my mom's 100K optional life insurance policy. Tried to cut me in on deal to keep quiet. I protested and was assaulted. Now lawyer sends me letter stating my mom will not pay the 400.00 premum from her retirement anymore; if I want my mother to have the 100K life insurance, I must pay the premium. Hilariously...I am not a beneficiary. The beneficiaries she currently has named don't have 400.00 a month to pay her premium. So why would I? Can my uncle declare his kid the beneficiary, pay the premium, and keep the 100K life ins going, then when she dies, his kid gets the money? I know this sounds totally insane. Yes, I have spoken to two lawyers, and have read everything there is on the subject. But I cannot determine WHY my mother cannot continue paying her life insurance premiums, when they have NO CASH VALUE, and the premiums are paid from her RETIREMENT INCOME from a PRIVATE EMPLOYERS FUND, not SS. And why on earth the executor of her will, who is also her POA is allowed to change her life ins beneficiaries and her will???!!!

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Your mom has no money to pay for life insurance premiums. That is why she can’t keep paying for them. She’s in a nursing home and on Medicaid/going on Medicaid. All of her monthly income-retirement and social security- goes to the nursing home with Medicaid paying whatever balance is left. The lawyers should have explained that to you. Applying for Medicaid doesn’t mean she can’t leave the nursing home either. But the bottom line is, if she is on Medicaid, she can’t afford to pay $400 a month for a life insurance premium. You don’t have to pay the premium either. I think the lawyer is maybe giving you the option to become owner of the policy maybe? And actually Medicaid won’t let your mom keep the policy if it’s a whole life insurance policy.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
hmmm, answered you once to say thankyou! message is gone, so will say again, thanks for helping me to understand, there is no cash value on the insurance, but Medicaid says it is an asset since they are willing to pay premium and be the beneficiary themselves. its the latest medicaid scam to move babyboomer savings, wealth, assets and 40 years of life insurance premiums (or what my mother said was my inheritance) back to the government.
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If you are not the beneficiary.. don't pay the bill! The POA can't force you too, he is responsible for taking care if her to her best interests.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
I am currently the benficiary. But the POA is allowed to change that anytime. So I could be paying that premium, and have no idea he has changed it so that I am NOT the beneficiary. It is all a scam by Medicaid to get the policy themselves. They will pay the premium, then when Mom ides, Medicaid gets the 100K. If it isnt law in your state now...it will be. Isnt it nuts?
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uh . .who IS the POA? Family member?
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
lol. how did you guess? her 300 lb brother "will take care of everything". we are talking Indiana here, where the POA has the power to do ANYTHING with the beneficiaries. My uncle assaulted me when I mentioned that I would not take a bribe to cut my bro and sis out of the will. But my family runs the town from county prosecutor on down.
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POA does NOT give you any authority to change beneficiaries or a will. Nor can he say that you have to pay anything for your mom.

I would contact Medicaid if he gifted himself anything from your mom, he is jeopardizing her Medicaid coverage. You can't just take her assets and expect the taxpayers to foot the bill. I would get on this right away because he could be putting your mom in real danger of no care or big bills that can't be paid and create a pain for whomever they call and hassle.

What state is this in, Alabama?
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
Indiana. The estate lawyer assures me that everything he has done and advised is utterly legal. My backup lawyer repping me says this is all legal. There are a million loopholes in Medicaid policy, they know how to exploit them, I guess. In this case, they pay off the appraiser to say the house isnt worth anything, so they can give it to the family flipper, or sell it to a friend, who will then give them a kickback. This is the way things work in southern Indiana. It is like 100 years ago Appalachians.
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Is it a term life policy? If so, the value decreases with age.

Her home was sold? Did that money buy a house for someone else?

Contact Adult Protective Services. There is something very wrong here.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
it is whole life, no cash value, pays 100K upon death at any age, to us three siblings. i am allowed to pay premium, but POA is allowed to change beneficiary, so i have no guarantee that i will be the bene when she dies. her home is being sold. that money is going to pay for her NH care. she owned two homes. the other one, and her car, was given to my brother. my sister and i got nothing except photos and some jewelry after Moms family sifted thru and took all valuables. mom signed the POA, but is terrified and bullied by family, she takes psych drugs, family runs town, no one is going to believe my mom. or me. but thank you, i think there is many things very wrong here, but im working on it!
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If Mom is going on Medicaid, the POA can do nothing. The lawyer is giving him the wrong info, if POA is telling the truth.

A POA does not give a person the right to change a will or beneficiaries on insurance policies. The house cannot be turned over to him or the car if Mom is going on Medicaid. There is a 5 year look back.

If Mom is on Medicaid or Medicaid pending, her SS and any pensions go to her care, she has no money. She is allowed 2k in her bank acct and gets PNA acct with maybe $50 for her care.

That 100k policy is really not worth paying 4800 a year for. I really can't believe her premium is this much. She probably has put 100k into the policy. Let it go. Her employer one is different if she is paying thru her pension.

I think you need a lawyer just to make sure the other lawyer is on the up and up.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
Thank you! I posted an answer that has some updated info. You have all been so helpful, I am learning a lot. So glad I joined this forum! I got my own lawyer. Unfortunately, he says in Indiana, the POA CAN legally change the beneficiary of a life ins policy. Can you believe that?
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Consult with your own attorney. You will probably need his services anyway (for yourself) as all of this unfolds. Protect your Mom and yourself! There ARE bad attorneys out there. And there are really good attorneys who recognize the bad ones and can straighten everything out on your and your mom's behalf. Document everything. Keep all paperwork. And go talk with a trusted attorney. It may cost you a little up front but may save you much more...financially and emotionally...later. I know someone who was in a similar position and a good attorney straightened it all out. I wish you all the best.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
Thank you for replying, I am working to get this mess straigtened out and have a good attorney that I trust. The rules are so crazy in Indiana, I had to hire one THERE. 2500 miles away!
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Hello folks, thank you for answering. I will share with you the incredible information I have received today from two lawyers.
1. In Indiana, Medicare considers ALL life insurance to be an asset. Medicare will pay the monthly premium and then collect the insurance when she dies. This is how they call it an asset: anything that reimburses them for her care that they have paid for is an asset. There is no cash value for this life insurance policy. It turns out it is only currently 200.00 a month and she has been paying a premium that has been going up since 1963. I know this is impossible to believe, but it is true. Medicare is gracious enough to allow ME to "purchase" her life insurance policy and pay the monthly premium. However, also in Indiana...
2. The Power of Attorney has the legal ability and right to change the life insurance policy beneficiaries. So, I am invited to pay the monthly premium, while he (POA uncle) is allowed to change the beneficiaries. Every lawyer I spoke with today assures me this is totally, absolutely true, in the state of Indiana.
3. The lawyer currently working on my mother's estate declared that Mom's car and my brother's home, which my mother owned outright, were not worth enough to matter to Medicaid and awarded the title of both of them to my brother. He said the 5 year lookback does not apply. it is true, the car was worth about 1K, and the home my brother lives in is worth about 3500.00.
4. Mom's only other asset is her home worth 130K, which was fair market appraised and sold to the POAs friend for that amount. None of us children, her only legal heirs, her only beneficiaries, were allowed to buy the home. We were not even aware this was going on. The POA did tell me that he was going to sell the house...but would not give me the name of the lawyer to discuss any of this with the lawyer. And at that point, assaulted, flabbergasted, I was in no shape to take care of any kind of business. I have recovered now and am able to effectively get legal advice, and have as of this morning, spoken with the estate lawyer's assistant. Who has assured me that everything I reported here to you is totally accurate and true.
5. My mother was in the hospital for a short time in February, this is when her family decided to let POA uncle "take over" and she has been railroaded into a NH, bullied into signing anything and everything by this 300 pound "brother", threatened to be placed in a mental hospital if she causes any trouble.
6. Essentially, since my mother DID sign the POA for my uncle, when she was practically unconscious due to dehydration in February, she has recovered to a large degree. She is currently being advised to "act like she cant walk", so she wont be thrown out of the NH, this is coming from the staff. As an aside, Mom in hospital, then rehab, was denied all of her usual psych meds, in the family effort to have her declared incapacitated. They took her in for "mental testing" according to mom. Family threatened to kill me if I interfered. But I finally get enough support that I arrived in early May. Once there, I had a total lawsuit- threatening fit with her docs and got her back on her usual psych meds. Docs inform me that family did not tell doc that Mom had 40 yr psych history. POA assaulted me over this conversation. Does no good to call police, my family is police force and government (such as there is) in this small town.
7. Mom is essentially not really much more than forgetful, with some anxiety and well placed terror over the roaming wheelchair bound demented crowd that corner her in her room. When she pushes the call button, she is chastised by staff for not being nice to the "sick old ladies" who open her door and invade her room.
8. To be clear, POA is her brother, my uncle. I am allowed to purchase her life insurance but no guarantee that I will be the beneficiary. If I do not purchase the life insurance and pay the premium, then Medicaid will do so and get the 100K.
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Can you move your mom out of that town, change POA and get her assets, cash from the sale of her house?

Why would her family want to do this to her? People with power will pay a very serious price for the abuse of it. Maybe not here and now, but eventually.
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worriedinCali Jun 2019
she has no authority to change POA. Only mom can do that and that ship has probably sailed because mom has Alzheimer’s/dementia and has likely been declared incompetent (all the phsyc testing OP mentioned). Guardianship is the next step
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Let Medicaid have the insurance policy. If I was going to pay 200 a month, I would want a legal document saying that the beneficiary could not be changed. And if it is, the POA would have to reinburse me for any monies I had put into it.

From your previous posts, I think ur going to have to let it all go for ur sanity. Make sure you have rights to visit Mom. Really, having her in a NH is not doing her brother any good. All he got out of it was a 1k car and a 3500 house. The money from her house goes for her care and the insurance policies to Medicaid.

I would ask a lawyer about monies being used to prepay her funeral. Either from the proceeds from her house or from the insurance money Medicaid will get.
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DesertCatlady Jun 2019
Apparently when I "purchase" the life insurance policy, this can stop my uncle (POA) from changing beneficiary. But I cannot at this time get this in writing. Having her in a NH is doing her brother (POA) a lot of good. The family does not believe in mental illness, has tortured her, her whole life for high IQ, self development activities, successful real estate ventures, whirlwind romances, exciting life, and now her hometown family is THRILLED to have financial and medical power over her. Her brother (POA) did not get anything out of this other than control. The lawyer gave MY brother the car and his home, that my mother owned outright, as my mother said she wanted my brother to have it, in her will, and her will not longer matters, as she will effectively HAVE no assets when she dies, so they simply gave my brother what my mother would have left to him had she died, and the lawyer said the car and his home were essentially worthless anyway. Im sorry I wasnt clear about which is who's brother. You are right about my sanity, for sure, it is very hard for ME to keep up with this charade. Her funeral is prepaid, even her headstone, her plot, etc. Thanks for that advice, I checked on that immediately. I guess my issue about the life insurance is that she has been paying on this policy since 1963, and has made it very clear the money is to go for my brother's upkeep (he is totally mentally ill, if it is not clear why he got a car and a house. This was the 21st car she purchased for him, and his 7th home. He trashes them over and over, forces her into bankruptcy, and the cycle starts over), but it is HER money for HER kid, and he will certainly need long term care himself at some point. So I think if I can ensure that either he or I or all3 of us siblings are the actual beneficiaries and that cannot be changed, I will probably choose to pay the 200.00 a month. My mother is 78. Her mother, her grandmother and her great grandmother all lived with dementia to over 100 years old. So your advice about letting Medicaid have it is probably sound! Im working on it and appreciate your input.
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