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Lately, we've been getting the newspapers for my mom to read while she is with us. Today, she became frantic when I went to collect the old ones and put them in the recycling bin. My daughter, who is autistic; can not understand her grandmother's irrational behavior; therefore it irrupted into a shouting match about the newspapers when she went to collect them. Now she is taking the papers we bought her today to read and stuffing them in between the pages of a magazine as if she is hiding them from us. She is now becoming a hoarder on top of everything else.

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It's hard to know what's going to tweak the thinking of a brain damage person. With dementia often comes paranoia. Becuz they can't remember where they put their things, order things aren't where they think they put them, they often develop the belief that someone is stealing from them. As time goes on they will often have less and less "things", mainly because WE have to take away some of their things so they get in less trouble. I had to take away all of their clothes from my aunt first and much later from my mom to prevent them from getting up at 230 in the morning and wanting to clean up and get ready to go somewhere.

So don't take them away, give her more. See where she puts them without commenting. Ask or have your daughter ask from time to time to "borrow" some of the papers for store ads or homework, just don't mention it again and don't give them back. If that doesn't work, collect them when she's out of the room or in the bathroom and can't see you do it. It's a way to minimize your frustration
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Who knows why, but she has a good reason that is known to her at the time when she wants to keep them, did she have birds, or pets in the past that she used papers for? In any event, they are important to her now and I would just remove them when she is not paying them any mind and just give her a new paper. I don't argue about anything anymore, question why, or I'd go a little further down the bonkers trail, I just remove stuff when she is not paying attention to these things, my mother's thing is TISSUES, my bane. I just bought 18 rolls of toilet paper, sometimes you got to go with the flow and make it work for you, don't bother trying to figure it out just figure out a way around it.
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My mom chose paper towels : ) They make her happy and she loves to fold them...we just have to keep her from trying to take the ones out of the trash.
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There are so few things the elderly can control over time. It isn't fair to them to let our irritations take their freedoms away when a situation is safe and harmless.
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My grandma did the same thing. She always said there was an article she planned to read or a coupon to clip. My mother on the other hand took her dog out often. Do to being on lasix. In both cases, as disease set in or progressed these things became obsession. OCD behavior. My grandfathers bed for example no longer had a frame or boxspring. The bed was held up by papers. When we finally cleared her house she had become a hoarder worse than anything I've seen in tv. And rats and feces everywhere. My mom...now wants dog to go out every min. Dog bites all over her cuz dog is pissed having to be disturbed constantly.
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So glad to find this and know I am not by myself. My Mom shuffles papers all day long! She starts with the daily paper and goes back through all of the ones that I haven't managed to get away from her! I used to read the paper religiously, but do so on the laptop now. Mom uses the paper to watch us and think we don't see her looking. We have to laugh, but oh, does it get annoying. It goes on from the time she gets up in the morning, until she goes to bed. She has practically worn my floor lamp out switching it on and off. I have had overdue and late bills because she stuffs anything in them, and then when I get a chance, I trash the papers, unknowning what is inside them! It sure does get annoying, but at least it is something for her to pass her time, plus she rereads and relooks at the same article, never any other ones, and cannot tell you anything she has "read". So glad to find this and know that I am not alone. Hang it there. It's a long, tough road and doesn't seem to get any better, I've found.
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First, stop getting the newspaper. Just change the date on the older ones. She won't know what date it is anyway. Secondly, start removing things a little at a time so her hoarding does not burden the rest of the household. Having an autistic child with their already challenged thinking is subject to agitations which none of the household needs. Try to decrease the stimuli as much as possible. Play soothing instrumental music at a lower volume (white noise it is called) to calm the environment. You have your hands full, so take time for yourself too!
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My mother has Alzheimer's. When she still lived at home the daily newspaper was her only way to know what day of the week it was and what month we were in.
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Every day Mom would ask me to check the mail and see if the paper had arrived yet. It was one of the few constants in her life that she could count on.

We let the papers pile up by the door where she could see them. Any tidying up or throwing anything out was reserved for Mom's nap times.

My particular pet peeve was Mom's obession with saving those hideous plastic grocery sacks. If we tried to throw them away she would go ballistic. It drove me crazy but she wanted to give them to the church for their book sale. Mind you, the church has one book sale each year so you can imagine how many grocery sacks we had stuffed into cupboards, below the sink and anywhere else with extra space.

I agree with one of the posters who said that the older you get, the less control you have. It's an annoyance but certainly something we can work around. My Mom has been gone 8 months now. Go with the flow, as I look back, was definitely the right way to handle it (or maybe I should say, the way that worked for us). Of course, the priority was her safety but then creature comforts followed right after that.
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Is your mom living with you permanently? If so, are there any options for her to take part in a day care program? Have you made plans for when your mom's care is too overwhelming? You have your plate full with supporting your daughter and her needs are the priority.
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And when one has Alzheimer's why is it vital they know the day of the week or what month it is? Do they have to go to work? Honestly...
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Let her have her papers. It is the only "company" she feels she can hold on to. Some family member messed with my Mom's TV and she was unable to turn it on. She began irrational and said "It is the only companion I have now".How sad, but true as she refuses to call her friends and when they call she isn't feeling well to visit. So let the papers be. Good luck and a hug!
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My dad is locks and keys. We moved him out of his house to assisted living and there were at least 300 keys strewn around. Locks and keys. Locks and keys. It seems they fixate on something and their brain just stays there.
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For my Mom it was paper towels and napkins which she folded and refolded constantly. Every time we went to dinner she'd want to take all the napkins. Her dresser would become full of them. But as long as they were discarded when she was asleep or gone she never noticed they were missing. That said her short term memory was non-existent. Now she is in a memory care facility. But I noticed the storage seat of her walker has quite a few napkins neatly folded inside it.
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Mom's is also napkins, and paper towels along with her newspapers. I was straightening the pillows on the couch the other day and there was a whole stack of napkins and towels, folded neatly under the pillow. She does this every time I give her something to eat, LOL! Yes, the newspapers do get annoying, but it is the only thing she has that she is even interested in. She ignores the TV. It is the only way that she knows what month of day of the week it is, too. But, then she forgets within 5 minutes. So sad. Sometimes we just have to go along with the
little annoyances to keep what sanity we have.
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Hoarding and rummaging seem to come with dementia. My husband hoards pens, twist ties and anything of his from the past. He has a wood boot box right in front of his seat in the living room with all his treasures and a few of mine which he has now laid claim to. Years ago he would earn sales award points for merchandise in his job and would have me pick out things for myself usually equal to the things he got for himself. Now they are all his and he has the story to tell everyone....over and over... how he earned them by being top in sales! He was in management positions for over 20 years after that, but most of his stories now go back to things that happened 25 or 30 years ago. He rummages through his belongings everyday sometimes even a few times a day and then arranges them all neatly again. He rummages through my things too, which I can tell because he is not as neat when he does this! All his life he was almost obsessively neat and orderly. This was one of the big changes I noticed when symptoms started appearing. He became very messy in most areas. Although, when it comes to his treasures he seems to be capable of the same neatness, he is not able to remember to do other simple things such as to close the kitchen cabinet doors after opening two or three of them to finally find the one that holds the glasses! I learned to just let him keep himself busy and content doing this. I end up hiding or hauling lots of things to work with me that I don't want him losing; learned to do this after he misplaced numerous bills and my tax documents twice! Handling as much bill paying and finances online as possible has been a godsend to remedy this problem. When he goes to sleep early in the evening every night, I will go collect some pens or whatever I need that he has stashed away. He never notices. With only a few exceptions, if it is out of sight it is out of mind. If something is newer, he never misses it, as it was never in his memory, just in his sight.
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My father in law was a hoarder. Throwing anything away caused him great anxiety. When his house was finally condemned, we moved him into assisted living facility. At first it was very difficult. He would not allow anything to be thrown away. He would hide his dirty diapers on hangers in the closet. He was so afraid of one of us throwing anything away, that when I tried to get him to change his pants (they stunk really badly) so I could wash them, he hid them and would walk around in nothing but a diaper. I got many calls from that place asking to help out. As his dementia progressed, he seemed to forget the hoarding. He now allows helpers to wash his clothing and diapers to be thrown away. He is now in a memory care unit and allows them to do whatever is needed. Your situation is much more difficult because she lives with you. Obviously you can't let her fill up your entire house with newspapers. Would she part with them if you kept making excuses that someone else needs them? My father in law hoarded things because he was sure they would be needed later. Could you tell her your friend just got a new puppy and she really needs some papers to train her puppy with?
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You can tell them the moon is really made with cheese it won't make one bit of difference, my mother will do what she wants to do when she wants to do it. When I help her undress, she has tissues spewing like a blizzard all over, I mean really, she has tissues up both sleeves, in all pockets, in any pocket, any where she can stuff them they are there. It is like a shake down, she will have my cell phone, brushes, combs, makeup, more of my stuff down her pants, in her shirt, Oh my God. Then she will walk into the living room with a donut and a cup of tea that she made herself!??. Other times she can't make a cup of tea and that's when I say is she playing me or what???? Anyhow, what I am saying is for your own sanity find a way to work around her craziness so you don't end up playing banjo with your lower lip, I try not to take it personally anymore that is.
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Oh your situation is so much like mine. I am laughing about the tissues. Mom has them stuffed everywhere also. In the bed, under the pillows and keeps one in each hand. She can't even wipe when she goes to the bathroom because she won't put her tissues down. Then I say, Mom you didn't wipe. She will say, yes, I did and then I ask where her paper is. She looks and sees that she didn't and I'm looking for, one of these days, for her to wipe her butt and her eyes and mouth with the same tissue!! More than likely, she already has!! Some days, I think I am going to go stark raving crazy, and today is one of them. Hugs and prayers to all of you caregivers.
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Yes Chloesgrams2012, tissues are giving me major issues. She is to storing them, saving them, stashing them, reusing them. I buy her pads for her underwear just in case, she thus far does not have incontinence, but she will throw away the pad and wad up half a roll of tp, tissues, paper towels. Arrrrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. SERENITY NOW
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You all have me laughing like a mad woman! We are right there with the tissues/napkins as well...no solution, but so wonderful to hear that it drives others crazy too! Oh I needed that belly laugh, Thank you!
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Ferris1 - They don't need to know what day it is, and it makes them kind of sad....

There is a scene in the book Still Alice when Alice keeps asking what time they are going to an event. One child says, "Mom, you don't have to worry. we will get you there on time." I forget the second sentence, but the third child says, "Mom can ask what time it is as often as she wants, and I will tell her every time."

Oh, these caregivers in books are such saints.

Full disclosure - I'm an apprentice hoarder myself.
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Well, I need to know what day it is so I can fend off the guys with the white coats coming for me. Thanks guys for helping me to know I am NOT ALONE in the land of tissue. You made me laugh too, well a snortle for now at least.
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Comments make me lol, blizzard of tissues, shake down of items in their clothes, locks and keys locks and keys, and not alone in the land of tissue! My mom went through some of this and also wanted to eat the paper towels, tissues and all paper. Now she has passed that stage and doesn't really do much anymore. We made her some "trinket boxes" filled with various items to "work on". She doesn't show any interest in those anymore either. Now she only plays with a stuffed animal. I try to remind myself that all the annoying things will go away with all the good stuff too. Back to the original post, I can't imagine caring for an elder and a special needs child with opposing issues in regard to the newspapers. I am completely inexperienced with autism but I wonder if there is any way to change the child's perspective about the newspapers? Some kind of way to get the child to help the elder in collecting them? Someone else said that it is harmless and as far as I can see it really is harmless.
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When you have dementia or Alzheimer's you do things that you would not normally do, there does not have to be a reason for it. My mother began to save all containers that held her coffee, both plastic and cardboard. They lined the shelves of the garage and I thought they were full/new until I picked one up and realized they were empty. I tried to toss them but she became upset so I began to toss out a couple here or there when she wasn't looking just to try and clean up some of the "collections." She never noticed that I got rid of them when I tossed just a few at a time and there was no argument.

I have to say however that you don't have to have dementia to do this. I worked for a very, very good doctor who horded newspapers. They came in daily but he never had time to read them, when we tried to clean them out he came unglued and they were stacked to the ceiling...still in the plastic wrappers!

Hoarding is hoarding they feel there is a very good reason to keep whatever the item(s) may be. Sometimes they may have grown up poor and everything was kept and reused or repurposed as we now say. Some people are creative or artistic and see the beauty in items they choose to keep. Sometimes they are just unable to rationalize that you read it already and you are getting a new one to take it's place so lets clean up the house and get rid of the old ones.

Why not let your Mom keep a few days of newspapers in her room, perhaps you could stack them on her dresser and then when she is not looking slip out the bottom one and toss it. If you can keep the quantity down I would let her and avoid an argument. If she is aware or wants to keep tons of them, I wouldn't let it get out of hand but ask her why she needs them and see if you can come up with a compromise, like no more than 5 days can be kept.

If she has never done this before, you can be assured it is the illness and she just cannot help herself. These mental illnesses cause our loved ones to do odd things.
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Gosh--if hoarding is symptomatic of dementia, then Mom had it decades ago! She'd hoarded most of her adult life--not just napkins, either--anything that caught her eye--always been pretty hopeless at organizing or maintaining things--she'd struggled all her life with that, getting worse at it when more kids came along & stress levels rose beyond her coping skills.
Stuff piled up in mounds that could reach 6' high, packing whole rooms but for a tiny area to sit in. She did shuffle thru some piles, but not all of them.
She hid valuables in some piles, which she'd forget, then scream about being robbed.
Food got hidden in piles of stuff, only to be found long later, rotting or rodent messed.
She was symptomatic of bipolar, multiple personalities, history of alcohol & other substance use, had history of a number of head injuries.
Quite a package, yet she always managed to skate by.
Then age & dementia caught up to her as well.
She'd go ballistic if she thot anyone messed with her messes--everything was precious--even the trash.

There was an old guy--very poor, townies here kinda looked out for, who lived in a van he'd stacked with papers & magazines--probably for insulation more than anything else--all he had was a long extension cord from a house nearby, to provide a light. Running a heater was dangerous, with all those papers stacked to the ceiling. When it finally got to the point he could no longer walk to the post office to pick up bags of food left there for him, he finally got moved to a nursing home. Poor thing was a skinny wraith by that time.

People often hoard things to get a sense of safety--if the room is too open, they feel insecure, fearful...so they make nests--even if it means they cannot even fully sleep in their bed.

Some hoard because they were badly affected by going through the Great Depression--paper, food, cloth items--paper & cloth were things one really really wanted when one couldn't afford to get more--stashing them was a safety net. The Dust Bowl caused food to be scarce for a long time, too--hoarding food is popular--all fed by fears.

G'ma , with Alzheimer's, collected small smooth beach rocks, penciled a word or phrase on each one, & set them all over her house on every horizontal surface...she was desperately trying to hold onto words & thoughts.
She got more rapidly disoriented every time one relative periodically took things out of her house [it was never hoarded], or threw away her message rocks.

We've mostly converted to using cloth for things we used to use paper for.
What if your elders who collect paper napkins, had some pretty cloth napkins & hankies? Wonder if they'd still collect paper napkins?
Although...if they hang onto those because they later use them for potty business, that could be a problem...clogged plumbing & such.
[[We finally installed a toilet with a 3" outlet, to match the waste pipe--that stopped clogs from too much paper, flushed old washrags, etc. from Mom's business.]]
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geedeeooo,
I have an adult child with ASD who came home for awhile.
AND Mom was under our roof during that.
Her behaviors upset him hugely--no ability to cope with her madness/behaviors.
We had managed to teach him to cope pretty well, considering there had been no programs to help us until recently--and those are for kids, not adults.

"When you have met one person with ASD, you have met ONE person with ASD".
Each very individual. Each has things they can deal with, and not.

While we were fairly successful teaching him how to cope with the world fairly well, there are still glitches. His roommate also has ASD.
Each has abilities the other lacks or has difficulty with.
Each escalates from various triggers.
Anxiety is constant companion.

The nature of those w/ASD ability to cope with a demented elder, can be difficult.
The Elder can't change, & in some things neither can a person with ASD.

Best idea might be: Keep the 2 of them separated, if possible
--protect your ASD kid from the Elder's behaviors.
A person w/ ASD, even high-functioning, usually cannot make sense of mental scrambled eggs in others!
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My 92 year old mil: napkins, paper towels, tissues, and toilet paper... I have to buy in bulk. I can't put a box of kleenex in the living room because it will end up in HER bedroom and tell me...how in this world can a 92 year old woman can go through up to 4 toilet rolls in one week? I am impressed by her ability to consume so much paper products!
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I previously answered your question but I wanted to add.....My mother reads her newspaper twice each morning and maybe again at lunch and sometimes after dinner as well. She does not remember that she has read it already so the news is new to her although I have heard it three times already. So maybe your Mom is just holding on to them because she does not remember that she already read them and is just holding on to them to "read later."
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As I am setting here reading the latest on AgingCare, my Mom is setting in her rocking chair re-reading yesterday's paper, just like it is all new news to her, which I am guessing it is because it seems she does not comprehend anything she looks at.
I know she doesn't understand anything in it, because we had a shootout in our neighborhood last weekend and it made the whole front page of our county paper and she had read and re-read it non-stop and doesn't even realize it was our neighborhood. So sad!! I'm beginning to think it is only as a cover for her watching our every move we make and thinking she is hidden in doing so. I just want to run away! LOL!
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