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She isn't at all. Couch smells, wont accept help with showering. I was going to tell her she either comes "clean" and tell me the truth or I will call her social worker. I hate to do that though, any suggestions???
Call her social worker. Get her proper help. Why on earth would you think it better for her if you engage in a battle of wills and force her to admit to you something that she is ashamed of?
Maybe the wording was a bit harsh but you do not know my mother. Very headstrong and stubborn, she does not have dementia, she does suffer from mild depression and she will fight you tooth and nail on anything and everything, If I call her social worker my mother will be upset, she does not want a stranger touching her, I on the other hand tried to help but she does not want me to see her in the shower. I just thought someone might have some tips, without me having to call the social worker. I want her to be TRUTHFUL with me, thats all. I told her she needs not be embarrassed, easier said than done, but I need the truth.
Hi, frustrating isn't it? In all the posts I've read there are all kinds of answers like fear, independence, etc. Who knows? They're all different. I know my Mom can't SEE the need because her eyes are bad. She doesn't seem to SMELL the need. Doesn't seem to care cuz she has no plans to see anyone. Fortunately, I found that her vanity worked in my favor. I had to actually mention the smell to her. "Would you like me to open your window to get some fresh air in here? I'd hate for you to be embarrassed if so and so sees that you look like you haven't showered for a week when they stop by.." Sweet as pie to her so it never seems like criticism. Or a Drs appointment the next day would always get her to shower. "If the Dr sees that I can't keep you clean I'm afraid they'll want to move you elswhere" Not my fault if the Dr reschedules ;) It's not a laughing matter, but try to find some way to keep your sense of humor. Also, is she afraid of falling? Can she see well in the shower? Has anyone told her that the couch smells? Careful honesty might help. From someone other than you. They sometimes spar with a caregiver out of boredom and to exert free will. Good luck, I hope things get better 👍🏼
And don't be bullied by people giving curt, or hurtful responses. You don't need to defend yourself. Most of us here understand and are in the same boat. ive found a lot of help here and am now preparing Mom for SNF after years with her. I explained what helped me in another post
I found a lot of help thru this website also with my dad. Now mom is beginning to slow down. I am going to talk to her without a threatening tone, I thought I did that already though, it just takes persistents I guess! Thanks all!
I apologise if you felt I was bullying you. But yes I was curt. You need the truth? You already know the truth. Why does your mother to have to get the words out? You say, for example, "TRUTHFUL... that's all." But in these circumstances, being truthful is not a little thing. Being truthful involves admitting that she's stained her own couch with body odour, maybe old urine. That's a painful confession, if you put yourself in her shoes.
I like Stressed's range of ideas for getting her to accept help very much. I especially agree with the point that it can be much easier to discuss these things with a professional outsider than it is for her to talk to you - someone she doesn't want to 'fail' in front of. Gently does it, and good luck.
Oh, and don't get hung up on her telling you the truth anymore. Sometimes their secrets (stinky as they may be) are the only thing they have to themselves anymore I guess. My mother tells lies like you wouldn't believe! I just tell myself that 'I' know the truth and have to deal with it as I know it
My husband doesn't wipe after bowel movements and showers about once a week. I clean him up as best I can. I found out recently that he is afraid to get into the shower because he is afraid of falling. He has serious mobility issues. Does your mom have friends who could casually bring up hygiene in conversation? Not aimed at her particular issues, but just in general. How about the doctor? Would she prefer a bath instead? Get her some nice towels, some pretty soaps and some fancy shampoo. Maybe that would work. Good luck.
Going with the idea of not being able to see in the shower and getting fun products to try, how about adding a bathing stool for the shower for safety? ( you may have all this already - just trying to suggest something not already mentioned). A nice shower wand that allows her a bit more control of the water pressure and direction. Maybe she needs grab bars etc. She might be worried about falling. It's generally considered a sign of depression to not want to bath but she might have just gotten out of the habit and then forgets and then you show up and notice. Does she change her clothes or her pjs or bed linens? Maybe a salon shampoo or mani-pedi would boost her interest in hygiene. Perhaps you could shampoo her sofa and give her house a good cleaning. Change the chi, if you will, of her space. One last thought, go into her shower and make sure it all works properly. My mother was very resistant to an aid helping her shower in the beginning. Then she just loved it. Would not go without her bath three times a week. She complained if she didn't get a good bath while she was in the hospital. My sister and I had a list of items we refused to compromise on with out caretaking. Cleanliness was one of them. So don't give up. Maybe you can get home health to come in and help her.
Just a thought about privacy - it isn't a problem for me but I can understand that sort of need for privacy. Why don't you get a towel and adapt it? Measure it round her above the bust and make sure it will wrap around her well, then fold the top over and stitch it down and run a thick length of elastic through it securing it at each end. Then for added security use velcro to secure about 3 inches down from the top edge. Then she can get in the shower and you can help her with the bits she can't manage and she can do the rest. If you think she will have difficulty with her genital area then get her a specially adapted handled sponge so she can do that for herself. Make sure there is a seat for her and a non slip mat - it may be that she doesn't feel secure so grab rails are a must if you don't have them already and you can also buy some scrubby shower shoes type things so she can clean her own feet without bending down. If everything that you try doesn't work then it is time to call for assistance. Instead of telling your mother she stinks and you know she is lying about having a shower try asking her if the shower is a scary place for her and what you could do to make it safer and better for her. Be ready for no helpful response by offering the things I mentioned above. Explain that you are worried because 'a friend's mother' wasn't showering and ended up in hospital with a severe skin infection. If she realises that in that situation the treatment will be highly embarrassing she might make more effort.
Now as to the furniture - that is going to be a nightmare to clean but baking soda will help take some of the smell away then a deep clean (possibly two or three) and if all else fails try white vinegar or simply consider throwing it out if that is a financially viable option - body smells are notoriously difficult to get rid of although professional cleaners may have more success than you will
Thank you all for your advice. My mom's doctor said he does not think it is dementia, but depression. I am going shopping for her and buying her powder and soap and shampoo, of all kinds and gonna see what happens this time. I also have a chair for the shower. Thank you!
JD, I think that you've gotten a lot of very good practical advice about getting your mom bathed here! But the question remains for your mom's doc; depression or dementia...what is s/he doing about it (the doc, that is)? Meds, further evaluation by a neurologist or psychiatrist. She COULD have both; the brain changes that happen in dementia often go hand in hand with brain changes that cause depressioin. but while dementia is not treatable, depression IS.
HugeMom- one quick comment on BM cleanup. My father was in his 90s and with arthritis/frailty it was getting to be a concern that family (and grandkids/greatgrandkids) visiting would get sick because of contamination. Looking back I should have installed an inexpensive "splay seat" that could have helped the health concern. I realize this is not an appealing subject but wanted to suggest a possible solution to consider.
It sounds like you have some ideas now to address the bathing issue. Good.
I'd like to urge you, please please, to drop the concern about "lying." You only want the truth from her. That turns this into a moral issue. It isn't. Whatever your mother's reasons are, it is not that she isn't showering because she is a "bad" person.
If the doctor thinks Mom has depression, is he treating her for depression?
My father won't clean himself. I recently figured out that he has behavior variant frontotemporal dementia. You want to rule that out. It is often misdiagnosed for mental illness such as bipolar and depression.
One characteristic of dementia is a loss of the sense of smell. She may not realize that you and others can detect the objectionable odor. The best option is a home health aide or a certified geriatric caregiver who can be there with you to help give her the next shower or bath. Be prepared with a shower chair that has a durable back on it so she can safely sit in the shower. Some geriatric patients are terrified of falling - especially in the obvious places (i.e.The shower, stairs, uneven surfaces, deep carpet, etc) so her lies may be a combination of fear, anxiety, loss of smell, denial, dementia or even a small stroke. Rigidity in the elderly is so common.
Huge battles of my father fighting my mother on the once a week shower. The solution was to get a once a week paid helper to come in with the prime reason being the shower. My father did realize that the guy was getting paid regardless of whether the shower was taken or out. After the first time there was no problem at all- it was easier on him with an outsider being the "bad guy" pushing for a shower.
jdfamilyinc: I had this problem (not as bad, though) with my late elderly mother. The way I dealt with it was point blank, e.g, "would you rather have your daughter (myself) or your best friend, E (name withheld for privacy reasons) tell you that you have an odor about you?"
jdfamilyinc: I personally am now physically incapable of having a bath as I need help to get out ... no amount of physical aid in the form of grab bars, etc., works for me, and I will NOT have my daughter help me out of the tub. Period. And stools are cold.
I, again personally, would love one of those seat/door/shower-handle tubs (oh he-double-toothpicks, you know what I mean -- a walk-in tub?) ... but can't afford it.
And it's not so much the standing, but the getting in and out, that scares me.
Has the doctor prescribed anything for depression? There is not much that's worse, you know, except dementia. That's depressing enough.
I couldn't believe my mom was lying so much. She taught us that telling the truth was ultra-important, and she never lied....But what was happening was that her short term memory was disappearing. She was making up the best answer she could think of to address the moment. Turns out she did have dementia / Early stage Alzheimer's as diagnosed by a the neurologist I took her to. She did think she was doing these hygiene things(bathing, brushing teeth, washing clothes etc). but she was not.
What kind of doctor sees your mother? Has she seen a mental health person? Can you get her to a geriatrician? Lots of old people stop wanting to bathe, and that's the kind of issue a geriatrician will look at. My husband has had two appointments, and the doctor is so interested and sympathetic and THOROUGH!
I echo Jeanne's point about "lying." Even if mom doesn't have dementia, she probably will, and then "telling the truth" loses its meaning. Do everything you can to allow her to save face.
Have you heard of Teepa Snow? Look her up on Youtube. Her techniques for dealing with dementia can be helpful with all elders. Blessings to you.
Dementia causes the loss of olfactory sense. Can't say if that has any bearing on your mom's situation. I, too, used the approach on my +80's mom with progressing dementia (who always had the most sensitive sense of smell) that she might be embarrassed if she knew how bad she smelled. Then I had to follow through with reminders and/or running the bath water and/or laying out some clean underwear as she would forget that discussion immediately. Often had to come up with some response to her "I bathed yesterday/this morning/already today" when the scent said otherwise like, "Well, you must have put dirty clothes back on and now smelly self needs washing again" or "You've been in those clothes for 4 days so it's time." Also developed over many years techniques for getting past her hostility and meanness directed at me.
She remains able to bathe herself; she just doesn't want to. It brings giggles when thinking of the "You stink" necessary for my 10-year-old grandson to get him in the shower!!! Which reminds that humor can often be helpful, esp. for you to hang on to your sanity during these times dealing with someone who is not the mother you have known.
Blessings and hugs going forward with this and other issues to come.
In the beginning I did manage to shower My Late Mother RIP Who had been suffering from Alzheimer's, but after a short spell of time the showers became less frequent. It was so much easier for Mammy to say NO to Me since I was Her full time Carer and Son, and I would just reply by saying We might take that shower tomorrow. Since this had been stressing Me so much I decided to ask Our great Friend Helen Who is a retired SRN if She would come and Care for Mother for four hours every week, to shower and check if there might be any bedsores. Result was A +, Mammy had Her shower every Tuesday and looked forward to it, and I can still see Helen putting on the powder and make up afterwards, as Mother looked like a Queen. I always complimented Mother after by saying OH MY GOD YOU LOOK AMAZING, and She did. Tender moments and wonderful memories that We can cherish in Our Heart forever. Good Luck and peace to All You Carers. You are All truly wonderful People, Who make Life so much better for Those Who You Love and Care for, John Joe.
Maybe your mother is scared to have a shower in case she slips over? Have you suggested a shower chair where she can sit down while having a shower, and also that someone comes to help her wash her back. Most elderly people cannot wash their back, although they will tell you they can. Try that angle and I hope it works. Arlene Hutcheon, New Zealand
For longer than I realized, my mom was telling me half-truths and odd things that didn't add up. Initially, her lies and errors of omission were delibetate. Because mom didn't want me to know how poorly she managed her day-to-day affairs. At some point, mom's lies surely crossed over into dementia collateral.
Either way, it IS an issue when elderly parents misrepresent things to their adult children. The neighbors knew my mom was falling in the yard and sending them on grocery runs for her and asking for help with routine tasks like closing the garage door and putting out her garbage -- but I didn't know any of that. For an embarassngly long time.
As I got closer to the situation, mom's duplicity about finances was a hard act to follow. I only learned the truth by sneaking and snooping.
Last but not least: Mom's dishonesty outlived her. Now her survivors are paying the price. Settling mom's estate has been an epic boondoggle -- thanks to her lies about how she had her affairs in order (not), key issues with her late husband's side business (unbenownst to us, almost in ruins) and where her important papers were stored (everywhere except where she said they were).
So sure, you can keep the peace by buying into our elderly parents' reality. And sooner or later, all the strategizing, scrambling and safety accommodations will fall squarely on the shoulders of the adult child.
If you have oodles of free time, oodles of money and the ability to clone yourself, it won't be too difficult. If you're like the rest of us, good luck.
In psychiatry, confabulation (verb: confabulate) is a memory disturbance, defined as the production of fabricated, distorted or misinterpreted memories about oneself or the world, without the conscious intention to deceive.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
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You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
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Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
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It's not a laughing matter, but try to find some way to keep your sense of humor.
Also, is she afraid of falling? Can she see well in the shower? Has anyone told her that the couch smells? Careful honesty might help. From someone other than you. They sometimes spar with a caregiver out of boredom and to exert free will.
Good luck, I hope things get better 👍🏼
I like Stressed's range of ideas for getting her to accept help very much. I especially agree with the point that it can be much easier to discuss these things with a professional outsider than it is for her to talk to you - someone she doesn't want to 'fail' in front of. Gently does it, and good luck.
Now as to the furniture - that is going to be a nightmare to clean but baking soda will help take some of the smell away then a deep clean (possibly two or three) and if all else fails try white vinegar or simply consider throwing it out if that is a financially viable option - body smells are notoriously difficult to get rid of although professional cleaners may have more success than you will
I'd like to urge you, please please, to drop the concern about "lying." You only want the truth from her. That turns this into a moral issue. It isn't. Whatever your mother's reasons are, it is not that she isn't showering because she is a "bad" person.
If the doctor thinks Mom has depression, is he treating her for depression?
I, again personally, would love one of those seat/door/shower-handle tubs (oh he-double-toothpicks, you know what I mean -- a walk-in tub?) ... but can't afford it.
And it's not so much the standing, but the getting in and out, that scares me.
Has the doctor prescribed anything for depression? There is not much that's worse, you know, except dementia. That's depressing enough.
I echo Jeanne's point about "lying." Even if mom doesn't have dementia, she probably will, and then "telling the truth" loses its meaning. Do everything you can to allow her to save face.
Have you heard of Teepa Snow? Look her up on Youtube. Her techniques for dealing with dementia can be helpful with all elders. Blessings to you.
She remains able to bathe herself; she just doesn't want to. It brings giggles when thinking of the "You stink" necessary for my 10-year-old grandson to get him in the shower!!! Which reminds that humor can often be helpful, esp. for you to hang on to your sanity during these times dealing with someone who is not the mother you have known.
Blessings and hugs going forward with this and other issues to come.
For longer than I realized, my mom was telling me half-truths and odd things that didn't add up. Initially, her lies and errors of omission were delibetate. Because mom didn't want me to know how poorly she managed her day-to-day affairs. At some point, mom's lies surely crossed over into dementia collateral.
Either way, it IS an issue when elderly parents misrepresent things to their adult children. The neighbors knew my mom was falling in the yard and sending them on grocery runs for her and asking for help with routine tasks like closing the garage door and putting out her garbage -- but I didn't know any of that. For an embarassngly long time.
As I got closer to the situation, mom's duplicity about finances was a hard act to follow. I only learned the truth by sneaking and snooping.
Last but not least: Mom's dishonesty outlived her. Now her survivors are paying the price. Settling mom's estate has been an epic boondoggle -- thanks to her lies about how she had her affairs in order (not), key issues with her late husband's side business (unbenownst to us, almost in ruins) and where her important papers were stored (everywhere except where she said they were).
So sure, you can keep the peace by buying into our elderly parents' reality. And sooner or later, all the strategizing, scrambling and safety accommodations will fall squarely on the shoulders of the adult child.
If you have oodles of free time, oodles of money and the ability to clone yourself, it won't be too difficult. If you're like the rest of us, good luck.