What to do with a Mother who won't sell her home and expects us to take care of her?

I realize that this is an old thread, but did want to comment on something in the original postings. There was something about the mom having gone to an "elder financial seminar" or something similar. I've had a little experience with the legal side of things, and some of those seminars are sales pitches for financial products that are not what they seem. One of my sisters-in-law got sold a refinance from a telemarketing reator
that turned out to be a problem, and it didn't cover what she was told and almost got her foreclosed on. There are good elder law and estate experts out there, and a good accountant and lawyer can see things that we can't. But be very suspicious of the ones who promise the moon.

My dear; your mom is her own worst enemy. She has loving children but doesn't trust enough to trust them.

This lack of trust is NOT your fault; it's a personality characteristic that develops very early in life. Nothing to do with YOU.

My husband used to try to get his mom to stop smoking. She had COPD and had been told many times that smoking was making it worse. When he talked to her about it, she told him he was abusing her and she was going to call APS on him. (This was after many, many years of dysfunction between them)

He walked away. He let a sibling who was totally under her thumb call the shots (the way she wanted) and she ended up refusing rehab after open heart surgery and willingly starved herself to death in a nursing home.

There is NOTHING that you can do about folks like this. The die is cast early and the thing to remember is that it has NOTHING to do with you or how much you love her. It has to do with how much she loves herself, or doesn't.

"but I truly feel that this is the only way to get her to agree."

No, that's the way to make sure she won't see you again.

Just resign your POA and put your resignation in writing to APS. Give them your brother's contact details, perhaps.

No you aren't GOING to H*ll, you are IN H*ll.
Your dramatic declaration never to speak to her again sounds like a spoiled child pitching a fit.
Have you earned the right to pitch one? No doubt BUT it clearly flushes out that you are way over extended and need out of the care taker role.
If mom wants to change her POA, that's her choice. She can always change it back again or have both of you or neither of you.
You may be exactly right about brother not being the perfect answer but you are toast. He's a lifeline you and mom need right now. He sounds perfectly reasonable to suggest you take one step at a time. We know he's got a few things going for him. He's fresh. He is willing and he lives a good distance away.
Go to a therapist. Get massages. Take walks. Meditate. Even take time away from speaking with mom. Give yourself a chance to miss her. You will.
And get a camera or a security system or a property manager for her house. Forward moms mail to brother. Help him get it arranged if you are able. If not, say so. I think you have their attention.
And you know what? You can always change your mind. It doesn't have to be forever, like death. There is a middle ground if you will accept it.

No one is forcing you to do anything you do not want to do. If you do not want to maintain the house - make sure your mom and brother know that. She/he might decide to make decisions that you do not agree with - if they are of sound mind, they can do so. But you also can make decisions as to what to do /not do.

I think "never speaking to her again" is a little harsh. Let her keep the d*mn house. You will continue to be her daughter, but you will no longer provide any assistance with said house. You do NOT have to take care of it by default.

Learn boundaries and stay strong. There is no reason YOU have to maintain it - mom can hire someone. Do NOT do what you DO NOT WANT TO DO.

My mom is almost 85 and has been in hospital and rehab 5 times in 6 months. Every time she goes back to her home post-rehab, she lasts no more than a couple of weeks before she is back in the hospital again, starting the cycle all over. She lost her drivers license about 9 months ago following a minor accident....but an accident nonetheless, following which the state mandated a driving test that she failed. She fought with me about having someone come 3x a week to take her shopping, to appointments, etc.....expecting me to do it. I live an hour away on a good day, have a job, and my own home to maintain. After she ended up in the hospital the first time, we bumped that care giving service to 7 days a week, 3x a day, as she now needed help with some daily living activities like showering, laundry, etc. Fast forward now 6 months, and she is currently in rehab again. At this point my husband and I finally said no more....it is time for you to go into assisted living. Her home is a tri-level, with bathrooms either 8 stairs up or 4 stairs down...no baths on the main level. She can't walk at all without a walker, and the last time she was home for only a few days, she tripped using her cane going up the stairs and severely bruised herself in the rib area....the home health care nurse said at one point she thought she may have broken a rib. She does not maintain her home at all by herself. I pay the bills, taxes, have to find repair folks for her when something breaks, the cable goes out, etc. I continually get calls from neighbors, the care givers, etc. about things like the lights are on all over the house but she's not answering the phone or door. She is also almost completely deaf and needs to wear her hearing aids at all times, but does not....and even with them, she still can't hear very well. She barricades the doors with chairs because she is afraid someone will break in at night. She is absolutely refusing to go into the assisted living apartment that we have gotten approval for, in an absolutely resort-like retirement village. She has the means to afford this very luxurious place, and my only sibling, who lives out of state, and I are willing to spend her money on her for this. But she has refused so vehemently that she goes into temper tantrums whenever I try to talk with her about it. The last time someone "anonymously" called Adult Protective Services on me, who "recommended" I stay away from her, quit harassing her and trying to put her into assisted living against her will, or they will charge me with emotional abuse. They say she is mentally competent and can make her own bad choices. They have also told me, however, that as her POA, if I don't make her home safe for her and something happens to her, I can be charged with neglect. So now my brother has gotten more involved, and he has come up with a plan to move her out to California to live with him and his family. Without going into a whole other dissertation on why this is a really bad idea, I have agreed to let him take over. However, I have said that I want her to give us permission to sell her house, which again, she is refusing to do, because I will still be saddled with the responsibility for maintaining it, which I no longer am willing to do....ESPECIALLY if she isn't even living here any more! My brother wants to wait a while, saying he will be able to talk her into selling once she is out there with him. I still do not want the responsibility for the house, so I have drawn the line and said that if she won't sell the house, I will step away from her completely and never see her again. I will relinquish all POA responsibilities and never speak with her again. She is choosing a house over me and my well being, which has suffered greatly over the past 6 months. My job is being affected, my marriage is being affected and most importantly, my health is being affected. I don't sleep, every time I eat I have to run to the bathroom 4 or 5 times, and mentally every waking minute is consumed with her and these issues. Even when I TRY to go out and do something enjoyable, my mind is constantly on all of this. I am trying to to do the right thing and put her in a place I know will make her happy. She used to be very social, but has become isolated living at home. That house is toxic for her in every way. She doesn't go out with the few friends she has left, and isn't involved in any community activities any more, even though she served as her village Women's Club president for over 8 years. My brother can't believe that I won't talk to her any more if she won't agree to sell the house, but I truly feel that this is the only way to get her to agree. And I feel that she needs to understand that her choices have consequences. My husband and I have been bending over backwards for the past 3 1/2 years since my dad died, to help her and try to keep her in her home as long as we could. But the time has come for change, and since she refused to consider making a move over the past 3 years, which we tried to convince her to do into independent living, it has now come down to some very harsh choices which, unfortunately, I have to make for her own good as well as mine. I already resent her and feel our relationship is "broken" because she is being so selfish and unreasonable and really shows that she doesn't care about anyone but her self. But I guess I will have a one way ticket to h*ll for treating my mother like this at the end of her life, right?

The cruel part of all of this is that it's just as terrifying to make change as it is to become less able and safe than you've always been. What a difficult place to be.

I tried to make sure mom knew there wouldn't be anything put in front of her that she couldn't handle because we were there with her. I don't know if it helped or not. She has always been defiantly stubborn and independent to an extreme fault.

Great answer, Sandwich. Thought-provoking, and about all the right questions.

This time of life is more challenging than colicky babies and a truckload of hormonal teenagers all at the same time.

This is where we have to get inside our parents' heads and see things the way they do. There are always fears present whether they are letting on or not. Pride plays a huge role. Pride is also part of denial. It's not happening.

My mom's doctor told her she couldn't be alone and needed to be near me. Her neighbors and people in town said the same thing. Keep in mind that I am and will always be the Evil Daughter who moved away and established my own life.

Mom revealed a lot of her inner workings to me on the phone, and I also took note of what she was NOT telling me. She was not talking about fresh vegetables & fruit at the store - in the form of complaints - her normal mode of conversing, activities at church or with the senior tripsters. She wasn't talking about visiting or having visitors. She no longer talked about clothes shopping - a full time hobby of hers for years. She stopped talking about sewing - her #1 source of income and interest for her whole working life.

She was talking about not being able to get done with sorting winter clothes out of the summer stuff - in July. What she couldn't do was even start.

I started logging this stuff - because I'm a nerd.
I could go back and count how many times she told me about the men with red eyes, squirrels on the fireplace, whatever it was she was talking about.

There came a day where I was bold and got lucky. I mentioned to her that "Mom, you've told me that same thing verbatim 12 times this month. We need to deal with it now." You've told me how scared you are at night 23 times.
Did you know you have had your refrigerator replaced 3 times in two years? You've told me about some falls 8 times this month.

Key questions to help them attach their own feelings to what's happening - assuming your loved one can still have this thought process.
==How does this make you feel?
==What do you think about how things are?
==Do you feel sometimes like this is all too hard to do? (yes, this is leading!)

Mom had no idea. I started planting seeds that there is another way. It took a long time to make this progression from "you'll have to carry me out in a pine box" to talking about moving to make life easier and safer. Persistence without being obnoxious about it. Sometimes you have to play it by ear and get lucky.

First of all, hugs to you. It is a very trying/frustrating time for all going through this. My husband & I have dealt with this experience with our elderly relatives. What I have learned is that it's a process of acceptance on their part.As they age, frailty, frequent hospital visits, they may start to become less resistant. My MIL, who was diagnosed with cancer, refused initially to live in our home to be cared for. As the disease progressed, she accepted she needed assistance & spent the last 6 mths in our home. My FIL( who was unable to care for himself alone),@ 1st, refused to live in an assisted living facility( the sale of his paid for house pays for his care). He eventually adjusted & enjoys all the activities offered. Currently we are dealing with the exact same issue as you are with my 90 year old Mom & 89 year old Aunt. Both adamantly refused to leave their homes and all options presented to them over the past 6 years. I understand it is a process of acceptance when they finally realize they can no longer live on their own. My mom had emergency surgery for a bowel obstruction, which left her bedridden & knows she can no longer live on her own. In order to be cared for in her home, she accepted the option(which was discussed with her years ago, but shot down) of having a wonderful live in caregiver( she too didn't want anyone to live in her home). The caregiver's salary is paid though the equity of her paid for house. I hope your parents will realize that all those years of working hard to accumulate their property, can now make that investment work towards their care now that they need it. Good luck to you.

First of all, hugs to you. It is a very trying/frustrating time for all going through this. My husband & I have dealt with this experience with our elderly relatives. What I have learned is that it's a process of acceptance on their part.As they age, frailty, frequent hospital visits, they may start to become less resistant. My MIL, who was diagnosed with cancer, refused initially to live in our home to be cared for. As the disease progressed, she accepted she needed assistance & spent the last 6 mths in our home. My FIL( who was unable to care for himself alone),@ 1st, refused to live in an assisted living facility( the sale of his paid for house pays for his care). He eventually adjusted & enjoys all the activities offered. Currently we are dealing with the exact same issue as you are with my 90 year old Mom & 89 year old Aunt. Both adamantly refused to leave their homes and all options presented to them over the past 6 years. I understand it is a process of acceptance when they finally realize they can no longer live on their own. My mom had emergency surgery for a bowel obstruction, which left her bedridden & knows she can no longer live on her own. In order to be cared for in her home, she accepted the option(which was discussed with her years ago, but shot down) of having a wonderful live in caregiver( she too didn't want anyone to live in her home). The caregiver's salary is paid though the equity of her paid for house. I hope your parents will realize that all those years of working hard to accumulate their property, can now make that investment work towards their care now that they need it. Good luck to you.

We all face this dilemma with aging parents. No one wants to lose their independence. But you know what's best and you may have to get her into an AL or NH.

We all face this to dilemma should our parents live this long. It's true that no one wants to lose their independence, but you have to make the decision when it's time for them to move into an AL or NH. Just went through this myself with my Mother. Unfortunately she died of a stroke.

I only meant that we're not just mean and selfish.

A lot of you here are SAINTS, I mean that.

I have something to say about seniors who don't want to be a burden, but don't have money saved up and don't want to go along with giving up their homes - we're all living on the same planet, the recession wiped out a lot of people, some people didn't have the ability to make big bucks.

Also consider how often you see your folks and talk to them. Sometimes we don't feel that people who don't see us more than 2-3 times a year can be trusted to really have our best interests at heart.

My mother still won't sell her house in Florida. She fell 8 years ago and moved to Tennessee to be near me and we moved her to an Assisted Living until she got tired of it and wouldn't leave her room then we moved her to an Independent living until she wouldn't go down to meals and was running out of money (because she wouldn't sell her house) so next to an apartment until she decided she can't live there by herself anymore and so finally into our house she comes and did I mention that she had not talked to my husband in 17 years. Now she still owns her home in Florida and we get to take care of her every need. All because her house is more important to her then her own daughters life. She has caused my to have severe depression, yet she has everything she wants. DO NOT ALLOW A PARENT TO MOVE INTO YOUR HOME. IT EATS UP YOUR LIFE.

Our family is in the same type of situation. Both of my parents did finally sell their old house after mom fell and broke her hip. That house had stairs, so they did it only after that crisis occurred. The move was very hard on them, but their new house has tile (which helps with mobility) and is much more manageable for them.

We share the caregiving between myself, my 24 year old daughter, and my brother and his older kids. I am single with a full time job with benefits, retirement plan, etc that I would never give up. My daughter recently got laid off so she helps during the day with their many doctors appointments. My brother works full time but comes on Saturdays to repair things, grocery shop, etc. I was doing it all alone for about 8 months but it was too overwhelming. I was getting sick, stressed out and depressed. We have been told by 4 professional that they need to go into IL or an ALF.They are in and out of the hospital and rehabilitation facilities every few months. We have talked to them about IL and ALF and there have been a few "crisis" events but they refuse to go. Like your mom, they also refuse to let strangers into their home.

And, you are not horrible, in any way. You obviously care about her enough to reach out for help. My mom and dad are finicky, picky, demanding, set in their ways, frustrated and I just try to keep them happy during this time in their lives. I could never live with them, either.

Is there a way to sell her current property and buy her a small place near your home, but not too close? Maybe in a very convenient location close to shopping, medical care, etc. Also, you should enlist several people that she trusts to help you. You can not do it alone. We (the family caregivers) all support each other emotionally during this time as well.
I hope you start seeing things going uphill soon, or at least in a more balanced way.

As geewiz posted, that generation is not familiar with the new and improved Assisted Living or retirement communities. My FIL (MIL wasn't able to make decisions) drug his feet on this and said they would never go into one. Once I lined up 3 for him to visit, he was quite impressed and even the food was a plus (that is big thing too for the elderly since they lived through the depression and food was scarce). Sooo, I would line up three for her to look at. Let her eat lunch or dinner and see what they have to offer and let HER make the choice (with a little of your input of course). Don't know if you can get her to even look. I tricked my mom a couple of times with saying lets go have lunch and then we went to alz facilities to see if they would be a good fit. She thought we were there to volunteer. If she doesn't get moved then something will happen to get her out of the house and you don't want that. Good Luck and God Bless....

My family struggles with this as well. I see that the comments are very reassuring, and we all need to feel that we're not being horrible people when it comes to these issues. I just want to add that, while we may be angry at our parents for their choices (or refusal to make one), it's ALWAYS important to keep in mind the big picture. I don't want to have any regrets when my parents are no longer around; I want to feel as if we did everything possible to help ease their pain, whether mental or physical. I'm keenly aware that my mother and father took care of us for decades, doing everything necessary to ensure that we had good lives. They didn't have an ideal marriage, they fought a lot, but they were dedicated to their children. Both my parents regret having put their mothers into institutions; they each cry when remembering the decision and the accompanying guilt/sorrow. I don't want to be that old woman crying over the decisions I made regarding my parents. I know that sounds selfish, but I believe even our most generous actions are self-centred. Can you get your brother more involved? Can you talk to one of her "angel friends" and see if they can be an ally? You're not responsible for her happiness, but your happiness might be tainted by not dealing with hers.

So sorry about thst, Curtain. I got all excited on your behalf.

Hi Babalou thanks for looking for me but I'm not in WA, I can't put my real info for privacy. Unfortunately I'm sure about the sad state of things in my state. Talked to AAA on options just not much here.

This is a trust no one situation. I'm sorry but the NHm can help only with the limited staff they have. Lets say at one place there are 25 residents in the memory care unit-one nurse, 3-4 workers CNAs, watching all these folks its really hard. Some medical personal think they can handle memory care but it is tough. Its yes, no, maybe, I don't know, I'll find out, but try to not agitate the residents. They are confused enough. They dig in nooks & crannies we wouldn't look. Things come up missing one way or another. They can't help it. It is the disease causing the brain cells to die so short term things are not remembered but alot of older memories are. But please understand when your loved is in their care, & your told go be a daughter & let us do our job & then, your loved one dies..well it changes your perspective. You will always need to be looking in at different times of the day just to be sure your loved is being looked after. It will not be like you would do it but we as caregivers at some point can't do it any more all the time. Things are going to happen & you won't have control but have to hope that you chose the best facility you can afford that will take care of your loved one. This is has hard a transition for us as your loved one. Expect

Curtain, is your mom in Washington State, per your profile? At least according to DHS website, Washington State has Assisted Living Facilities that are under Medicaid contracts. You might want to check that out. Perhaps things have changed, or maybe someone gave you incorrect information. It's worth looking into.

These elderly people just don't think. They imagine they're going to be 30 0r 40 forever and when they're not able to do stuff "someone" will do it for them.

I'm in my mid 60s, an only child, been on my own and made my own way always. When my late mother went into a NH 3 years ago I bought a tiny dilapidated cottage in the middle of nowhere and darn near froze to death the first two winters but it was all I could afford and over time I've fixed it up. I bought it with a view to my getting older plus I have some physical issues.

Everything in the house is main floor. There are two steps down to the mudroom and out to a deck plus 2 steps out to the north driveway. I replaced the huge jetted (didn't work) with a shower, splurged on new siding, windows, a wood stove and a generator.

Close to two acres, which takes about 3 hours to mow on the tractor. Raised veggie beds put in as I don't bend well and a coop & run for meat chickens being constructed shortly ... going back to a simpler lifestyle. After going through some welfare bums/junkies & local deadbeats I've been lucky enough to find a super decent handyman locally who will be here in ten minutes if there's an emergency, for which I'm so grateful.

I worked as a legal secretary/law clerk my whole career and for the past year or so I've got things organized such that when my mother passed things would go as smoothly as possible. She passed September 12 and there has been much to do but I'm getting there.

An A1 narcissist, selfish and so mean, she leaves me with so many unanswered questions ... she had everything she ever wanted so why was she so evil? I will never know. I can only assume she was mentally ill her whole life. She passed 3 weeks ago and the funeral home is holding her ashes.

Since she passed I've not grieved as we were never close (far from it), just felt in a no mans land, can't seem to get my act together and, apart from tending to my critters, get little done around the place. Towards the end of this week I must go scatter her ashes where she wished. Perhaps, in some way, that will give me closure.

I have a similar bind as CarlaCB, my mother is poor but not poor enough for Medicaid. And even if she were to spend down her assets - which she would fight like hell not to do while neglecting her needs, there are no assisted living centers that take Medicaid here. And she's also is not ready for the nursing home. The help that is available for those that qualify is pretty scary in my state - really bottom of the barrel folks that you'd be scared to have in your house. I'm not exaggerating. So it puts family in a terrible bind - either you help or "really bad things" happen. And if your parent still passes as mentally competent (like mine) you also can't take over. The degree of self-neglect necessary for official intervention is very high, so walking away until she gets "bad off" enough seems cruel and possibly illegal.

Yep I can relate. I'm in mid 60's, semi-retired, parents 87 & 89, lost my Dad this year. Mother has had 2 hernia repairs, broke leg once then again same leg month later lower down. She was impatient she thinks & didn't wait for CNA to help in the restroom so she thinks she slipped out the wheelchair. My Mom thinks she can still be in control. I'm sure I would have the same problem giving up independence. The heavy sedation drugs from surgerys takes a toll on their brain. Morphine & dilaudin (sp), etc. Second time back in NHm put her way behind progress wise but doing PT again & now on 84th day-medicare pays up to 100th day coming up she won't qualify for medicad so either extend stay at our cost $5400/month plus medicine plus labs drawn plus clothes toiletries laundry hair salon adult briefs if needed creams if needed for bed & foot sores, etc. And if they get sick..It is expensive! This NHm was ranked 3.5-4. Only one here that has 2 doctors that actually visit the NHm that can follow patients from hospital stay. Most have a doctor available via the nursing staff. So..I'm fixing to check into AL. I can tell ya'll from the past year it has been a down hill spiral. Life as I knew it has been put on hold. Relationship killer. Even though my Mom is in the NHm she now has, since the 2nd fall, 24/7 personal pay CNAs just to be sure she doesn't do anything she isn't supposed to which is a lot of the time. I was getting so burnt & I'm not sure I've caught up on rest yet. She is now on Aricept & Namenda for Alhizemers. Even in the AL brochure claims they charge extra per month for extra services. There is 24/7 help from what i've read but no doctor only nurse/cnas. Haven't checked about Physical Therapy on site. Calling 911 is a night mare. EMTs come then fire truck then ambulance. If checked into the hospital from ER, have to be sure they change status from observation to actual floor patient. Just got the new medicare 2016 booklet in the mail at least 1/2 inch thick. I've learned a lot in this past year. There are papers in stacks all over the dining room table, around the recliner where I now seat to go thru mail & figure all this stuff out. It is crazy the amount of papers medicare & insurance folks send out. No way folks at 89 & 87 yrs. with any kind of mental decline could understand all this stuff. Take care It is good to vent. Thanks.

babalou, great advice about saying "Mom, I can't do this anymore".... it took me some type not to give in every time I said to my parents that I could no longer do something. I remember my Dad and I going around and around about me getting him 30 bags of mulch. He just wouldn't take no for an answer.

Finally me breaking my shoulder last spring did put a damper on the demands... yet he figured I could still go to Home Depot and the employees would put those 30 bags into my vehicle. He wasn't thinking about who is going to unload that mulch..... [sigh]. Order it, Dad, and have it delivered. Oh no, he wasn't going to pay a delivery charge :P Where is my helmet, this is a head banging moment.

Multipass, start saying you can't do this or that anymore. I found by enabling my parents it had kept them living much longer in their large home, but in the mean time it was stressing me out to where I didn't have the energy to take care of my own home :(

No, nobody has applied for Medicaid for my Mom. Two reasons. One is that she doesn't need help with any ADLs, just all the IADLs. The other is that where she lives, she would have to go to a nursing home to use Medicaid. There are no PACE centers in her county. She is nowhere near ready mentally or emotionally for a nursing home.

If she were eligible for a nursing home, I would not sacrifice my life to keep her out of one. Believe me.

Has she applied for Medicaid? That's a first step. It gets her qualified ( at least where I am) for all sorts of programs.

What would happen to her if she had no children? Or if you lived in Timbuktu, or were in prison?

Many years ago, I lived next door to a lady who was a senior when I moved in, and was quite infirm and blind, by the time her children approached me to do some caregiving for her. I said no, firmly. Offers to pay, etc., arguments of, but you'll be able to pay someone to clean your house, watch your kids. NO.

They figured it out. They were scattered across the country. One came for a week and got the Medicaid application started and was able to get her qualified for some in home care. I know it's not simple. But it can be done.

Babalou - If it were only that simple! My mother has no money to hire help. She has no money for assisted living. She has two other daughters who live nearby, both of whom are older than me and in precarious health themselves. One is taking care of a husband who is battling cancer.

On one hand, I know that as long as I stay here doing what I'm doing, nobody is motivated to look for any other solutions. On the other hand, I know that other solutions are going to be very difficult to come by, and are going to cause a lot of suffering.

"Mom, I can't do this anymore." is the easy part. The hard part if figuring out the answer to her next question, which will undoubtedly be "But who is going to do it then? How can I possibly manage?" Those are the answers I don't have.