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My Mother moved in three months ago. I am pretty sure I read in the admitting paperwork that it was not allowed. Since she has been there, the ongoing problem with incontinence has continued, along with her refusal to acknowledge that there is a problem. Or to wear depends. Just a week ago, we finally took away all her underwear. OT is coming in now to work with her on multiple things, including showering, putting on a depends brief, etc. While this has been helpful, she goes to bed with just her nightgown. Because of all the issues, we have pads on the bed. So she thinks she doesn't need to wear anything, and says she isn't having any problem. And that if she did, there are pads on the bed.


When she stands, there is a big wet spot of the carpet with urine.


I am truly ready to pull my hair out! My mother's short term memory is gone! So when I call and ask, did they come in last night and make sure you have your briefs on, she doesn't remember. Does not remember if she had one on when she woke up.



I feel like the only way I can find out anything is to constantly call the nurses station. Which I am asking about what happened the evening before with a different shift.



Honestly, I am frustrated about a lot of things with AL. My life has gotten much harder since she went. I guess I will just stick with this one issue for now. I live 40 minutes away, so I just go down twice a week for now. Not worried about abuse, but it would just help me know what was going on.

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Freqflyer her camera has been up for over a year now. I'm sure someone in the AL has noticed it but haven't said a word to me. As far as asking her to leave that's highly unlikely given the expensive rent she pays and their diligence in keeping the occupeny level up.
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Reply to Crystals9369
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Putting cameras in the room, especially if the facility's contract specifies no cameras, could create legal problems for you. Check with your state's laws first. You could talk to the facility administrator, but the issues include: the staff that helps your mother would be 'on camera', which, each staff member would have to agree to. If one does not, then it is a no-go. Also, staff would have to consistently turn it off/on when taking care of your mother's personal needs including changing her clothing, maybe sponge bath, or other activities, so that it would not be on camera. You could place the camera without asking for permission but that would open you to legal issues,

Based on what you are describing, your mother requires more care than she is currently receiving, indicating that she might need to be reassessed and placed in a higher care environment, like MC.
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Reply to Annabelle18
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I saw a program on a local Okla P.B.S. station in which a small group of A/L centers are allowing cameras in the room. It can actually benefit both the A/L staff and the resident/family....I believe its a good idea..sort of like body cams...
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Reply to Sooner51
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hoolyk: Perhaps your mother requires a higher level of care, e.g. memory care.
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Reply to Llamalover47
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I sense a disconnect from the issue of your mom refusing needed care and the cameras. Or some dots not connected here -

What will cameras 'do' if your mother continually refuses incontinence care? You want to see these episodes (as they happen) ? Why? What good will that do?

RECOMMENDATION: Find someone - through a local church, Next Door, somewhere - neighbor - friend who lives in the vicinity to visit / and provide the observations you want. You likely would need to pay someone although it is worth it for another to be your 'eyes and ears' on a regular basis.

* It sounds like a major issue is your mom's refusal and questioning if she needs:

1) more or be on medication (to be more compliant to get the care she needs)
2) consider moving her to the next level of care where she will get more care and/or round the clock observation/care.
3) You / family would be responsible to bring in your own CNAs to manage care more so 'around the clock' (this is the work I did for years before I started to manage all elder care and hire caregivers).
4) Your mom will likely ALWAYS be resistant. This is part of the brain chemistry changing. Never ever argue. This will only have her dig her feet more solid in her position. Logic often (99.9%) doesn't work. Your mom needs more / different strategies to provide the care she needs.

* [Realize that] CNA's / aids are over-extended as it is (I am going through the same here in Marin County, CA facility for my friend) ... some do all they can, some don't care much - it is a mixed bag. Most / some facilities are short staffed.
- Are you speaking to the administrator of the facility?
I'd recommend you call the social worker, administrator --- someone who can talk to the CNAs / hands-on care providers. (May or may not work however, the administrator should know what's going on and manage care needs).
- Create a journal: date, time, situation and take photos. You want to document all you can.

P.S. I have a client in memory care facility and she pees 'all the time' on the carpet, requiring on going regular cleaning, paid by the family. Facility offers one cleaning per year. Your mom seems to need much more care than she is currently getting.

Gena
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Reply to TouchMatters
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My mom went into a large assisted living and I asked only one favor: leave the radio we provided be kept tuned to local public radio station so she could listen to the opera. Soon it was apparent that staff were changing it to a rock station. When asked how to deal with this I was told that due to multiple levels of supervision fixing this was impossible. The next day we moved her to an AL where this problem was easily fixed. Luckily we live in a metro area with lots of choices. But, when possible move on and place in a trustworthy setting. Mom remained there 12 years before passing and no problems. Silly? Maybe. But we took this refusal to deal with a small problem indicative of larger ones.
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Reply to bkoropchak123
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Probably can't do cameras but maybe check. If you can talk over it, like Ring, you could be giving comfort. They should have cameras for themselves!

The next best thing is pop in often and random times, be there at bedtime a couple times, etc. Go out of the room when they help her, but listen. AL places are like teenagers: private, usually with good intentions but sometimes make bad choices. You have to figure a lot out with little info, in order to keep your loved one safe & happy there.

Bells bladder tea 1x mug per day will take incontinence away. Takes 2 weeks to build in your system. Then magic. My Mom suffered the worst incontinence. Bells guarantees for good reason.
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Reply to SueGood
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In Ohio, a law was passed in the spring that allowed for families to place cameras in rooms. I have a Wyze camera in my husband's room in the SNF. They do have a sign posted on the door stating that there is a camera in the room.
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Reply to Jane61
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You can not install a camera without the consent of the facility. Your mom has the right to refuse care... And, yes, this is frustrating.

Consider putting down a tarp with foam pad on top - for secure footing - to protect the carpeting. Or, ask that the carpeting be removed.
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Reply to Taarna
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Hello!
We had similar issues with my mom when she was in AL; she went in one week before COVID lockdown!!

The facility had wifi, so we bought an iPad and wall mount and had maintenance install it next to her bed where we could see her in bed or on her couch. I mentioned this before on the forum; it was a GODSEND! You can program the iPad to auto answer and leave it plugged in.

I usually called mom 3 times a day, my brother called 1 time a day, and my daughter called every night. Mom loved it, and we loved it. We could check on everything, and we were always chatty with the aides if they were in the room. We would tell her to urinate before bed every night and put on her depends. We stayed right on the screen until we knew she was all set and tucked in. Truly, I have no idea how we would have made it thru COVID without that.

Some places will allow you to pay an extra fee to put her on a toileting schedule. I think at my mom’s place it was an extra 1200$ per month. We didn’t need to do that thanks to the iPad.

You may also want to have her checked for a UTI. My mom wasn’t really incontinent until she started having UTI’s. Her main problem was stress incontinence; she would wet from the force of getting out of bed with a full bladder.

The aides don’t have it easy. In NY, regs allow one aide for every 18 residents. Eventually, when she did go to MC, it was one aide for every 8 residents. Big difference. But the aides at MC LOVED my mom, because she was pleasant and talkative.

Good luck!
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Reply to caroljnorris
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My dad is in an ALF that has a mix of stages of dementia. The amount of care is determined by Level of Care programs. I like this as he sees
lots of activity and in with the general population. The memory units I visited were depressing. We
did put cameras in the room. One in the bedroom and one in the living room. No audio. Blink has an affordable camera. We saw dad fall three times and called the nurse station. They are setting him up with an alert necklace system and we got a better walker. The cameras allowed us to see the lightweight walker was usually the reason for the falls. His falls were always at night when he got up to use the bathroom. We did find a private person to stay overnight in his living Room area to help when he gets up and this has worked out perfectly. The ALF has actually used some of our videos for training purposes.
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Reply to Skelly1230
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my mom was in AL and it was a lot of work for me because she didn’t know/remember what she had done or not done. I prayed and then one day, I asked the receptionist if there were private caregivers in this place. She said yes and mom’s private caregiver began immediately. It was initially 3 days a week and then when her client passed, she became 5 days a week and another lady for 2 days. I chose 1-5 p.m. but I initially had 2-6 p.m. there was a 4 hour minimum but some caregivers are good about 2 hour minimums. I am so grateful for the wonderful people God put in my mom’s and my life. Mom spends a lot of time in bed-she is always tire-wearing out. But the 4 hours of care gets her out of bed, showered, lotioned, hair done, walking and engaged. She is mobile but fearful so the caregiver is wonderful to get her to events-even though she only watches-she enjoys. Mom was in AL and had cameras and a sign outside the door that said Surveillance inside. Her new place does not allow and it was hard to adjust. It has created more dependence on God for me and that is always a good thing.
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Reply to Tandemfun4us
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I installed a wireless cam in Mom room at memory care. I notified the facility, but did not ask permission. They did put a sign on her door that said "camera in use". You may find as I did that watching hours and hours of the video that it is more depressing than helpful, but in your situation, its worth a try.
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Reply to scrabblequeen
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It sounds like your mother needs a higher level of care than AL. Assisted Living is not Care Taking.
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Reply to RedVanAnnie
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I did! I didn’t ask anyones permission either. I just stuck one up in the corner of her room. Don’t ask just do it.
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Reply to Crystals9369
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freqflyer Nov 17, 2022
Crystal, if you placed a camera in a room without the facility permission, violating the Contract to live there, then the facility could either ask you to remove that camera or ask your Mother to find a new facility to live.

Please note, there are hackers out there who can hack into these cameras and place what they find on the Internet. I know I wouldn't want strangers watching my mother dress or any other personal care.
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Have your mother reassessed for placement level needs. It sounds like she has declined from ALF appropriateness and, she needs more skilled care and/ or memory care placement.

As for video, you should revisit the facility guidelines and/ or speak with administration at the facility.
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Reply to janicemeyer18
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Not sure if the video method is possible. AL? Your mother should transfer to a SNF.
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Reply to Patathome01
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Its not reasonable to expect caregivers to insist your mother wear Depends to bed, and ensure that she is. AL is for reasonably independent seniors with mild dementia who are cognizant enough to realize they need incontinence briefs 24/7 and who are willing to wear them.

Your mother, at 95, needs memory care for a higher level of care and attention from staff who will help her toilet every 2 hours and also ensure she's wearing Depends 24/7. Just bc she's talkative doesn't mean she's not in need of more care. Why do people think elders have to be drooling and bedridden to "belong" in Memory Care? She may not WANT to move there, but she needs that level of care. In her AL or a different one if her current ALF can't see the need for her to segue into that level of care.

My mother could chew the ear off a goat and lived in Memory Care Assisted Living for nearly 3 years. She was not drooling or bedridden or stupid in any way. Just riddled with dementia and in need of more care than regular AL could accommodate and not ENOUGH care to warrant Skilled Nursing.

You're frustrated with AL bc you are expecting them to care for your mother as if she were in Memory Care but she's not. What's going on is mom needs a higher level of care which she won't get in AL. In reality, you don't have to manage her care....once the staff realizes she requires more care than they can give her, then you'll be called to make a decision about where to move her next. And if this AL claims she "doesnt need mc" then ask them what their CARE PLAN is for mother to ensure she's toileted every 2 hrs and dressed in clean Depends 24/7? Put it back on them to figure this out, one way or another.

Good luck to you
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Reply to lealonnie1
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It's made your life harder because she belongs in memory care, not AL.

The camera won't solve your problems, but moving her to the proper level of care will.
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Reply to MJ1929
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My real struggle here is what is a reasonable expectation for Assisted Living?? Ie services to be provided?
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Reply to hoolyk
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imadaughter17 Nov 17, 2022
For my Mom, they cleaned the room and changed the sheets. They provided depends which my mom used. They made sure she took her meds. they provided 3 meals a day. They used a special tub to bathe her twice a week. Mom used a scooter to get around. They offered a lot of activities. They would provide one person assist to get out of bed and toilet but when she needed two she was told she had to move to SNF. Her memory was going so I took care of her finances. Lock down was very hard on her. HTH
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Thanks for your responses.
it really threw my
mother off base to move there. Her memory and all went downhill. I moved her there because she knew someone in AL I would hate to move her again. The facility has memory care. But they tell me it would not be a good fit for her. Because she is quite conversational etc. I guess most of the people In their memory care unit are much worse off. So it would be a negative. So that isn’t really an option for me. It would upset her terribly. She doesn’t require lock down. She goes out to play bridge currently. She is 95
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Babs2013 Nov 17, 2022
Your mother still can go out to play bridge in a memory care place. My BIL is in a memory care place and he can be taken out to do things so that won't be the problem for your mother. My BIL short term memory is gone from dementia. The place where we have him do things with them to keep them active. My BIL wears a watch it lets the aides know when he is close to the door where he can't go out by himself. And my BIL has a problem with changing rooms but they will get settled into a room after awhile as long as you make it like home. We have done that he has his recliner, end table, his tv, has his hats hinging on the closet door, has snacks in his drawer, has a mini fridge for his diet pepsi, has his comforter on his bed and has his pictures on the walls.

Instead of relying on nurses that can't really do the constant watching because assisted living is just to assist where the memory care they really take care of their clients.

If it was me I would consider memory care or you will be going thru this for a very long time. Unless you pay for someone to come in and take care of your mother.

My BIL fell outside of his apartment where he was living alone he laid on the ground for 30 minutes until someone found him that is why he is in a place where they can take care of him. He still can take a shower and dress himself but does need help with other things and the place where he is now is awesome at their job.

Prayers that you can work this out for her
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Your Mom may be needing soon more care than an ALF can give her, and she may require MC. I agree with glad, that if the paperwork says no, then no is the answer. I would speak with administration, as our guesses are only guesses. Good luck.
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Reply to AlvaDeer
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If the facility prohibits it then you can not put a camera in the room. If there is nothing about it then you have to follow the States rules. Some prohibit audio, some states you need 2 party consent. You can not place a camera in an area where a person should expect privacy. So none in the bathroom.
It is possible that you mom might need more assistance than AL provides and MC might be a better option
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Reply to Grandma1954
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Sounds like the contract says cameras are not allowed. Check it. If no in the contract then the answer is no.
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